Everyone knows about rotator cuff injuries but I wonder how many of us know how the rotator cuff can be damaged by how we sit at our keyboards. Yes, it is true! I am currently undergoing therapy for a very painful rotator cuff. Unlike injuries, which often result in serious tears and painful recovery from surgery, the damaged caused by how we sit at our keyboards has to do with poor posture and slumping shoulders and the long term effect on the shoulder blade muscles that keep the rotator cuff in proper position. I don't know how all this happens but as the therapist explained it to me it takes a bit of time for the muscles to reach a point where they don't properly support the rotator cuff functions. The best protection is to make sure you are not slumping your shoulders while sitting at your keyboard or while doing other daily activities and if possible doing exercises which strengthen the shoulder blade muscles. I'm sure there is more to this but I thought it an interesting topic worth posting.

Deane

Sitting Positioning is the first thing children learn in piano class... a good position keeps you from straining many of your body parts...

Good posture was taught in grade school when I was a kid. My piano teacher told me when I was 5 years old to sit at the piano in a position that would be like a hard-backed chair with arms. My arms and the chair arms should be horizontal, my back should be straight, my thighs should be horizontal and my calves should be straight. I've pretty much tried to stick to this posture throughout my playing life, but now my back is shot to Hell, which causes my legs to go to sleep after just one hour in that position. Getting old sucks, and it ain't for wimps and sissies.

Gary

I don't have great keyboard posture, but I do use an adjustable stool and vary the height several times during the night, just to change positions. I have the most comfortable seat in the house!

Deane.......I can't believe that you posted this and I almost missed it. That's exactly what I'm going through now. It started in my left shoulder about 1-2 years ago and now my right shoulder is hurting since last month. It got so bad I had to completely stop weight-lifting.

I originally went to a chiropractor who diagnosed it as a "rotator cuff" problem and treated me regularly for it. He also told me my "shoulder blades" are out of balance and that I needed to do corrective exercises. Finally last month my medical doctor had me take an MRI. They found a small tear but he said "live with it."

I do believe that years of keyboard work, accordion work, and hunching over this darn computer has led up to this. I'm in pain every day. Luckily I can still play, but I think it's just making it worse.

You sound like you're in a better place than I am to fix what's going on with you. I tore the cartilage in my knee a few years back, went to 1/2 dozen orthopedists and doctors and, bottom line is..........no one cares! It's easier to talk to God than it is to talk to an American doctor. They all basically tell you the same thing......this is what's wrong....either have surgery or "live with it." Nothing in-between, like exercise, nutrition, acupuncture, etc.

I haven't figured out what I'm going to do about my rotator cuff situation, but I'll tell you what I'm NOT going to do........waste any more time and money going to your average money-hungry American doctor.

Mark

Deane,

Thanks for the info.

About once or twice a year I experience severe shoulder pain, and never made the connection.

My last bout lasted about two months. It finally went away with resistance band exercises.

There are many YouTube videos on the subject.

Here is basically what I do.

http://www.orthoassociates.com/_pdfs/Rotator_cuff_HEP.pdf





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In other words, if you screw it up, you’re on your own.

Changing positions slightly is a wise thing, not to much for it to become uncomfortable, but enough to put restrain on other parts of your body instead of the same place all the time

Cue music ... ... " I get no kick from champagne ..." ... but I do get a kick out of people who will go to doctor after doctor, get the same diagnosis and complain because they are not hearing what THEY want to hear ... anyone ever think that maybe, JUST MAYBE, these highly educated and skilled individuals MIGHT know what they are talking about ?!? ... Yes, doctors make mistakes - they are human, and quite often they are making a diagnosis based on what WE are telling them - but for the most part, I am willing to bet that at least 50% of the people on this forum over the age of 50 have had some major procedure successfully performed by some doctor ...
And when it comes to something like a torn knee cartilage, I am sorry to say, the only true remedy IS surgery ... you can try different kinds of injections, acupuncture, exercise, diet, whatever, but NOTHING external is going to REPAIR a torn cartilage ... and as that thing keeps flopping around in the knee the mobility decreases and the pain increases ... believe me, been there done that, BOTH knees, and am I ever thankful for total knee replacement surgery ...
My wife had rotator cuff surgery after she got to the point that she couldn't lift anything and she is far better off for having done so ... she will soon be undergoing hip replacement, and we are both absolutely confident she will be doing much better in a few months ...

I wish you all well, and hopefully all our ails are healed by some mystical intervention, but in the meanwhile, I will continue to utilize the trained professionals, with all the modern means they have at hand to determine the problem and evaluate the best course of action, and trust in their judgement ...

BTW - Disclaimer: The only medical professional in our family is our son, who happens to be an excellent dentist.

Yeah....they might be "highly skilled" and "highly educated" but what good is all that training if they have no bedside manners and particularly a definite shortage of communication skills and their only real interest in you is their vision of a "cash cow" who will soon foot the bill for their next vacation when they perform my surgery.

Orthopedists in these parts, live in a world of black and white....."black" being statements like "your meniscus is torn"..."you have a rotator cuff problem," and, "white" being "go right to surgery...do not pass "Go," do not collect $200" (as in Monopoly).

I like to function in the "grey zone" where you don't just listen to the diagnosis and head right for surgery. They charge enough money. Is it too much to ask them to take some time to sit and "discuss" other possible treatments BEFORE surgery or a possible "misdiagnosis?"

It seems their allegiance to the Hippocratic Oath has shifted to their allegiance to money, as in....."pay the bill at the desk, and don't let the door hit you on the way out."

I was telling a friend about my experiences. She replied with a great line: "You still don't get it! Orthopedics are like car mechanics. They tell you what's wrong with your car, and hand you the same line..."you can perform surgery on the car"......OR...."live with it! The only actual conversation you actually have with them is the cost of the repair."

Hopefully it's different in other parts of the world, but that's the way it is around here.

Jerry....my doctor refuses to discuss that my shoulder problem might be from playing the piano too hard with my left hand. Hence, I'm left with trying to self-diagnosis.

I'm unable to download the PDF. I'll have to go to the library to do it. But, is that about the "resistance band exercises?" My instinct tells me I can get some real benefit from stretching and corrective exercises.

For anyone reading this, my doctor DID explain about "inflammation" of the entire body causing the pain. I notice when I take my prescribed "anti-inflammatory" medication the pain subsides.

I did read a lot about "inflammation" on the Internet. It's something I was never aware of. It comes from stress, old age, improper nutrition, etc. You might want to look at that.

Mark

Mark, a lot of individuals look at physicians and surgeons through rose colored glasses. Yes, they are very highly educated, and for the most part, quite intelligent, at least scholastically. Then there is the flip side of this coin. The vast majority of the physicians I worked with had zero common sense, which is a big part of the problem, medically. They narrowly viewed each malady as if there were only one way to treat it, the way they learned in medical school, and no other method was viable, at least to them.

The next part of the equation is only a very small percentage of physicians and surgeons are top notch, and for the most part, the general public has absolutely no way of determining who is the best and who is the worst. I've worked with the best, and the worst. And, because of my extensive medical background and training, I'm able to determine which I want working on ME, and the ones that I don't want in the same zip code with me if I have a medical issue. I figure, from my experience, that about 1 percent of the physicians and surgeons are at the very top of the list, while the vast majority are somewhere in the middle to bottom of the competence level.

And, while I have the advantage of knowing what questions to ask, and what certain medications can do, and their subsequent side effects, I still manage to get myself into trouble by going to a doctor based upon recommendations from a friend or relative that claims they're great. In reality, very few individuals on this forum have any idea whatsoever as to whether their doctor is treating them properly for the malady(s) they have.

Fortunately, over the past decade, some internet sources have developed that will allow you to do a background search of individual physicians, and view comments from other patients. This can sometimes be quite beneficial. Additionally, sites such as WebMD provide solid information on drugs, their side effects, dossages, etc..., and various disease information, all of which is quite informative.

The difficult part is deciding which avenue of approach to take in an attempt to bring about your recovery. The greed and corruption aspect of medicine seems to be on the rise lately, which in most instances, can be harmful to the patient(s) of these practices.

I recently went to a neurosurgeon about my horrendous back pain. A red light went off in my head when I walked into the office and noticed that this neurosurgeon was with an orthopedic surgical group - just didn't make sense. Before seeing the physician, am attractive young lady had me put a pair one size fits all paper shorts, then escorted me to a room where a series of X-rays were taken of my back. I told her that I had X-rays from two weeks ago with me, and she said "We always want our own." A second red light went off in my head.

After sitting for 40 minutes in an exam room that was as cold as a meat locker, I said to myself, if no one shows up in the next 5 minutes, I'm outa' here! Four minutes later the door opened, and that same young gal said the doctor will be here in just a few minutes. I told her that he had one minute or I would be leaving. He came in a few seconds after she closed the door, looking a bit indignant, then apologizing for being late. He had a laptop in one hand, and a cup of coffee in the other.

He sat down with the laptop, asked me a few questions, looked at the X-rays they had just taken (they were on his laptop), then pressed on my back in a few locations and asked if it hurt. Then he had me take a few steps across the room, and said, I want to get some more X-rays, only this time of your hips. It was back to the X-ray room, then another 30 minutes of waiting in the meat locker.

This time, when he walked through the door with his laptop, he sat down and said, well, you have a lot of arthritis in your hips and I think we should replace your hips and your back problem will go away. BINGO! Game's over, Doc! I got up, walked to where my clothes were hanging, and said, "thanks, but no thanks - I'm outta here!" His ortho group would have made a cool $100,000 on my hips being replaced, I would have been no better off, physically, and likely ended up in a nursing home as an invalid.

I later went to an orthopedic surgeon that specialized in back surgery, he had an EMG study and MRI performed on me, then spent about 10 minutes with me in an exam room and said, "Gary, your back is really messed up, but there is so much scar tissue from previous surgeries that it would be very dangerous to try to surgically correct the problem, and a good outcome would be unlikely. This guy was honest, up front, and not a money grubber.

Almost forgot: For the next three months after seeing the neurosurgeon, the guy that ordered all those unnecessary, additional, X-rays, I received bill, after bill, after bill, for X-rays, and things I never heard of, all of which were above and beyond the coverage levels of Medicare and my Blue Cross - Blue Shield supplemental coverage. My out of pocket expenses to see a quack doctor were just over $200.

Bottom line, the vast majority of patients have absolutely no idea how good or bad their physicians and surgeons are. There is no litmus test for this. And, while self diagnosis is not a good thing, at least most of the time, being aware of ALL treatment options is something that every person owes to themselves and loved ones.

Sorry about the rant, and Good luck,

Gary

Unfortunately, you really have to be sceptical about the treatments doctors suggest.
In the complicated German health care system, accounting regulations for hospitals change from time to time.
Depending on how the current regulations about remunerations are, hospitals change their behavior, e.g. wherease some years ago patients had to stay in hospital for two weeks after small surgeries or treatments, now they are thrown out of the hospital bed when the bleeding has hardly stopped - reason is, hospitals used to get 'credit points' for each day a patient was in hospital, and how they get the credit points for each operation performed, so there interest is to get rid of the patients as early as possible.
Due to the new regulations, many hospitals propose surgery much too early although conservative treatments would be promising.
It's a scandal.

Gary......don't be sorry about the "rant" .....that's one of the best posts you ever did. I'm going to nominate it for the Nobel prize!

So then, it's not my imagination, my opinion, nor bad luck. That's just the way it is!

I was blessed with good health all my life, no operations, nothing serious. So now I'm getting a harsh lesson on what it's like out there in the real world, and not my imaginary altruistic world.

I don't say anything to anyone about my daily pain and my multiplying injuries, 'cause no one really cares anyway. But, looking back, I remember always thinking that should I ever get sick, you just........go to a doctor. At this point, I'll go to a veterinarian before I see another orthopedist.

I'll tell you a quick story. The last orthorpedist, I checked out his track record...he passed with flying colors. I telephoned and talked to the office manager about my past experiences with other doctors. She assured me he will "take the time to discuss my situation. She even called me back the next day and said she "spoke to him and he understands my needs." I set up the appt and went there with high hopes. Like you said, he wasn't in the office 30 seconds when he sent me to the next room for an x-ray. It didn't matter that I had a recent MRI and a 2 month old x-ray already in my hand. When it finally came to "discussion time," every time I went to ask a question he would cut me off with the same line: "I'm the doctor and you're the patient." Worst manners I've ever seen in anyone....you have to go to school and take a course in "ill-manners" to be that bad! Then he had the nerve to ask me "did he answer all my questions?" And he cut me off again when I tried to say "no!" The next day when I recovered from that horrific visit, I telephoned the office to complain about his unprofessional manner. The response from the doctor was......tell Mr. ABC he's not welcome back in this office and to collect his records and find another doctor. Worse......he telephoned my primary doctor to "warn him" that I might be psychotic. Kind of like "the pot calling the kettle black." Luckily my primary doctor has been treating me for 40 years and is my friend as well as my PM. He knew better.

I'm going to print out what you wrote here and read it over a few times. And then plan some kind of a course of action with these injuries now that you've convinced me it's a mine field out there. But I need to do something before I can't play anymore, much less weight-lift.

Mark