How important is your audience(s)? What If you could make $3,000.00-5,000 per 30 hour (straight 30 hours) session, playing in a dark room, looking at several monitors? What if 1/2 or more of the work was using sampled sounds to "color" an image?

Would you do it? Would you do 2 sessions a week?

Would the money be enough?

Russ

Many years ago, I would have done it, however, at this stage of life - not a prayer. I can no longer do 30 hour stints, which I did at one time in my life when I worked in the field of medicine. I often spent 30 hours straight working in the operating room, for up to 12 hours, then another 20 hours with the same patient in the recovery room and CCU. That was just the way things were back then.

When I was a working musician/entertainer, my audiences were what kept me going, and inspired me. I loved all my audiences and they were an integral part of my being on stage. Without the audiences, show biz is NOT show biz. It's just another job.

All the best,

Gary

Ditto, now the audience is the Ocean!.....Gary well said..




the lyrics say it all

Im currently in a love affair with my audience, in the absence of a beautiful redhead, but I'm also fond of eating, and paying the bills, so my answer is this:
My audience is EXTREMELY important ... whether in front of me while I perform, or at the end result of my labors in the presentation. I get motivated by the audience ... it's more of a "conversation" than a show, really. That being said, I LOVE, love, love working on fine details and mixing, and tweaking in the studio to make something truly beautiful.

Hire me for a week, and I'll co-produce one of your presentations ... then we'll go try to find a decent cup of coffee (in Kentucky??), served by a redhead with all her teeth!

Yes, I love Studio work I do a lot of it .

any time Captain.

I know one, Dave. She'll even put her teeth in for you!

Thats no fun...just sayin'..

a little detail. This client (there are 4) is a large manufacturer of commercial hauling equipment. The audio part does not start until the film (20 minute) is 3/4 in the can. Attending various parts of the production are: A plant manager, a chief engineer, a legal guy, a producer, a film editor, and audio engineer several other musicians (sometimes?)and three people from the national advertising agency.

Typically, the film is scheduled for worldwide distribution at 8:00 PM on Tuesday morning. I arrive at 4:00 P.M. Sunday. From 4:00 to about 10, I do a treatment based on the roughs. That is reviewed as it is created by the producer and whomever else shows up. With a partial OK on the concept, the bed is produced (includes lots of tempo changes, sampled sounds of the manufacturing process, etc.It is finished and "rough fitted" by about 8:00 AM, when all hell breaks loose. That's when Advertising Agency people (a creative director, account supervisor, continuity director, etc.) show up with the job of making contributions (read "changes") without knowing anything about film or music.

Then, from 8:00 AM until completion (6:00 PM-midnight)it's a run to the finish with lots of "tuning", legal changes,etc.

I am also paid to control continuity (re-writes that happen in real time), am the "big picture" guy, who fixes all the problems.

It's a music factory (really, a sound factory). We use all house owned instruments which are placed, tuned and otherwise adjusted to the producer and engineer's preferences. A change, adding a different player (I do 90% of all the playing)would require instrument changes and other actions that add cost and time. We don't have either.

Even though I'm not an entertainer, it's refreshing to see faces smiling back at you, occasionally. For that reason, I'm keeping a little 4 night country club job and a twice a month B-3 job. Just need a little fix every once in a while.

Today, there is more work for producers of UTube kinds of industrial productions than ever before. They are replacing print, big-time....Annual Reports...installation instructions....publicity releases, etc. And there's an audio track for each piece of a certain level.

Versatility, patience and the ability to stay up for days is what's required.

It's music ,plus. It's exhausting, rarely creative and can drive you nuts.

But, it's work and the pay is GREAT.

Breaking in is another thing. You don't do staffing calls/auditions. It's word of mouth from production insiders.
Your completed reel is your audition.

Check it out! If you're good enough, you can earn as much as mid-level corporate officers. ($250,000.00, plus).


But, you'll always miss the live (read-"people") element.


Check it out!


Russ

I know absolutely zip about this, (no doubt it shows:)) but I thought actual musicians (players) were getting less of the pie now. I'd have thought the biz was being overrun by geeks bearing soundfonts and virtual this and virtual that.

And a plant manager, an engineer, a lawyer, an account supervisor, etc. get input into the music?

Keep 'em at bay, Mr. Lay!

Actually, while important, music (or, really, the audio track, including V/O, sound effects, etc.) is only a part of the production. The plant manager, lawyer, etc. are there for approval of the ENTIRE project, of which audio is an important, but sort of "journeyman" part. The project is done in a video editing suite, which has audio at one end. There are sometimes three off-line edits of components going on simultaneously, a major edit of the shell and music being recorded either in real time or of-line to click tracks.

Remember, these are internal communications documents, where message (and timing) is all important.

Commercial and internal film production, with simultaneous audio production is a hi bred communication category. And it's growing by leaps and bounds. Getting ever more demanding, too.

Contrast this with the scores that are done with more time, using sampling and other popular techniques and you have a completely different animal....generally, anything from film maker shorts to full length movies. Budgets vary widely. With business to business films, the score is, sadly, secondary, and generally, only 15-20% of the final production.

Another aspect of modern music production in today's market.

R.

Man, that's complex. Thanks, Russ.

Ruws, that sounds like a prescription for a major heart attack! No amount of money is worth a full blown miacardial infarction, which is one of the reasons I got out of the medical field. I worked a lot of 100-hour weeks, my weight fell to 145 pounds, and I smoked like a chimney. I rarely saw my wife and family, only got to see my relatives at funerals, and didn't know the name of the family that lived 3 doors down the street. After 15 years, I walked away and never looked back. I was offered a lot of money to return, but after thinking long and hard about it, I turned it down. Life is very short, old friend - I should know. While I love the outdoors, love sailing, fishing, bicyclinbg, all of those things have since taken a back seat to my nasty lung condition that now requires me to be on oxygen. As I have said so many times in the past, take some time to smell the roses before they place those roses on the lid of your casket.

Good luck,

Gary

On the face of things, I certainly agree with Gary from a health standpoint. OOTH, with Russ obvious near genius in the juggling of a multitude of carefully orchestrated steps in bringing the project to fruition, I can imagine that any career decisions are not as simple as declining a gig.

I’m betting that questions should be;

1-How much do you love money and what will you do for it?
OR
2-How much do you love yourself?

After a number of hours of playing the music you are playing begins to have no meaning; it’s just notes without feeling. So you would not be doing it for the love of music.

Just saying, John C.

John, you're right. In my case, music has been one element, along with communication research, graphics, film production, marketing, etc. of a broad spectrum of communication related activities. This is what my graduate work is in. I worked as a VP for the world's largest electrical company. My company does communications projects (packaging, electronic communications, print, etc.), and music is an integral par of most of the work.

I like writing copy and playing music equally, for instance. This kind of music is just one critical element in creating messages appropriate for the project.

In this case, music is a secondary, although very important element of the process.

It's more acceptable to me, because I get my satisfaction from the completed project, not just from completing the score, copy, editing, etc.

If I tried to make a living playing what I wanted to, I'd starve to death. This way, I get to concentrate on the over-all project(s), which I love to do.

As a "non-entertainer", I really don't miss the constant feedback some need. What I do need is the unspoken communication between musicians of the same caliber.

We smile a lot as, together, we play ourselves out of a job (LOL)!

I laugh, but that's not far from the truth.

I could NEVER just play music. I also could NEVER not play music.

This I how I manage my life, and the result is more than enough to generate the resources to help lots of people and groups who really need it.

Sorry for the rant. And, yes, sometimes I really do miss the audience.


Russ

PS. I understand the "heart attack in progress" issue, but I LOVE tight deadlines and have been doing things like this for over 50 years, with no plans to quit anytime soon.

Russell, recording projects to me are a way of injecting more of my personality into the music...since retiring to OAS, I only need to take the projects that appeal to me, and give me an opportunity to use my style making skills, and utilize the arranging techniques I learned during my Electone teaching years.

My trusty Tyros4 is pretty much perfect for my recording needs, and my satisfaction now comes from a job well done. No audience required...and after many years of trying to please the aforementioned, I'm now going to spend the rest of my playing days amusing and pleasing myself.

If I need more input in a project, there are those I can call for both solid advice, and even more solid playing skills...again, as you say, "unspoken communication" is the key element that breathes life into the arrangement and/or recording.

I don't plan on workin' hard ever again...so there's not much likelihood of me getting a "studio tan" during this summer or the next one either....good luck with your projects, and most of all, stay healthy...sick musicians aren't usually very creative.

Ian

Russ I DO understand you and that scares me. You are not the normal run-of-the-mill kind of guy. So why do I understand you? That’s the part that scare me.

Russ when it’s easy send me a PM telling me a little about your background – I’m interested.

John C.

"Russ when it’s easy send me a PM telling me a little about your background"
Much of it is Classified. It's only released on a need-to-know basis.
The people who create Halloween costumes look in his closet for skeletons!
Russ has "nieces" in all 50 states and four foreign nations.
Somebody stop me, I'm on a roll!

Again, if you weren't so damn tall, I'd kick your wrinkled old A**! But, I have to stop laughing my wrinkled old a** off, first.

Best personal regards, always!

R.

See? No denials!

Old Friend, truth be told, it's probably like looking in a mirror.

Mine would have to be lowered a little, but, still....!

R.

Same here, Russ. You're an interesting guy. I read and enjoy your posts, but I think I would "read and enjoy your posts" more if I knew your background.....the direction you're coming from. Maybe if I pay an "optional" fee, you'll include things like how you got into music and how you got to be a deep thinker?......so I can "read and enjoy" your posts more!

Go for broke. Make it public!

Mark

John, Mark. Sent private PM's. Sorry for the rambling.


Russ