I am not saying anything new to you stereo guys, but I was blown away by the following personal experience last night at a big dinner I played at:

I have an Audya 76, Pa4X, and a Yamaha S970 that I regularly use, but the S970 was being used occasionally only for small events. I have a Bose compact and a stereo Spacestation V3.

The Audya and Korg seem to do well with either amp, but favor the Spacestation. The S970 just sounded weak, not bad, but compressed. Still, there is a lot to like about it, with the myriad of styles, easy work fkow, and light weight. I love the stereo effect of the Spacestation, and know Yamaha works better in stereo, but I never had any balls with it before.

My solution for last night was to team the Yamaha with the Spacestion and a Z2200 Logitech sub I had, and VOILA, what a sound. To go one step more, I ordered a remote and extension for the Logitech controls, which is better than the original. This way, I could dial the indensity and volume with a turn of the dial. The old sub is small, light, and only an 8 incher, but, for those that remember it, it was very powerful.

Yamaha has now rejoined my arsenal.

seems like everyone who bought a SS has a lacking bass problem.....for a few bucks more you can buy two
LD Maui 5's and have all the bass you want and a great stereo sound too in a lightweight portable package...

Lack of bass was a deal breaker for me on the SS too. I didn't want to have to lug around a sub with it.
I did find out last week that the PA4X loses something when summed to mono. Not as much as the Yamaha loses, but still, the sounds that are designed to use stereo effects suffered somewhat in mono when I was without one of my Maui 5s for a week. I had to change my default piano sound. I didn't realize how much until I hooked back up in my normal configuration!

Yes, but I can keep $1200 in my pocket and have a smaller footprint with the SS on top of the Logitech. I have great stereo, and can adjust the bass in an instant without fiddling with the keyboard.

Hey no problem here! I still have two Logitech systems. One is in my office and the other in the entertainment room. Still going strong after all these years. They do have great bass.

Others may sneer, but you,I, and Gary, to name a few, know what they are, regardless of what they were sold as.

Thanks

I got tired blowing my windows out... using Gary's advice.

Bernie ... I still have a Z5500 which is getting NO use, but I am interested in how you 'wired up' the Z2200 and the SS ... I may want to try the Z5500 sub for a couple of larger gigs I have coming up ...
thanks

Back in the days of having two 10” Eon stereo speakers did improve the sound.

My questions:

1-Did using stereo speakers improve the sound 10’ to 12’ from my keyboard. What did they hear?

2-Did the people nearer to one side or the other miss something. If my strings were panned 85% to the right the people on the left did not hear much of the strings sound.

John C.

PS, How, if any does the sound improve if a "Y" cable is used to combine R and L channels.

Tony

I opted to get the improved controls and extension to have more length.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SummitLink-Logitech-Z-2300-Computer-Speaker-Replacement-Control-Pod-Wired/132123370292?_trksid=p2385738.c100677.m4598&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20160908110712%26meid%3D420ad936160c45dba9794d7d8c660d39%26pid%3D100677%26rk%3D6%26rkt%3D20%26sd%3D25286214050

This isn't mandatory however. I used a double RCA to 1/4 in adapter, and plugged into the back sub slot of the SSv3.

John, a lot of this depends upon how far apart the speakers are placed on either side of the keyboard. Additionally, with conventional speakers, the cone angle is usually about 45 to 50 degrees at best, so if those stereo speakers are spread wide upon the stage, the audiences will suffer with heavily stereo sampled sounds, such as Yamaha's Grand Piano and others. The fullness of the sound comes in the crossover area, which is the point where the left and right sounds collide on the dance-floor.

Many years ago, I saw an entertainer that had a pair of Eon 10s on stage. The speakers were 20 feet on either side of the keyboard. If you stood 20 feet in front of the keyboard, the sound was fine, but if you were at a table to the extreme left or extreme right, all you heard were the sounds from the right or left channel - not the combined sound. This was one of the many reasons I switched to the Bose L1 PAS when it first became available. I fed the left channel into channel 1 of the onboard mixer and the right into channel 2. The combination was just awesome. At that point I never looked back.

Using a "Y" connector essentially accomplishes the same thing as the mixer, but not quite as efficiently. If you plug into the mono output of most arranger keyboards, it does the same thing, only instead of using a "Y" connector, it does it electronically with an internal switching network. If you look at the schematic diagrams of the audio output of the arranger keyboards you can readily see how this is accomplished.

Now, stereo does sound a lot fuller, especially with heavily stereo sampled sounds - THAT'S A FACT! But, in order to make it all sound fantastic, those speakers should not be placed farther than a few feet on either side of the keyboard. This will provide you with the maximum crossover area and the best possible sound.

All the best,

Gary

Actually, Bernie, I wanted to know how you hooked up your KB to the sub and the SS ... what cables/wires did you plug in and where - KB to sub - KB to SS, SS to sub ???
thanks,

I plugged the sub into the SS as above, and KB to SS.

I have plenty of bass with my SSV.3 and PA4X combo. The MAXX system on my 4X really provides a lot of control for dialing in bass.

That said, I only use the SSV.3 for small venues and small rooms with seniors. I've even had to dial the bass back at times.

Perhaps the bass is an issue in larger venues. But then, I don't think that was what the SSV3 was designed for.

many of these amps produce what I call bleeding bass which I personally displeasure.......
I favor a really tight bass with my music and thats what I listen for when choosing a sound system.

Exactly

Most acts I hear pump out more bass than I'd choose ... even in dance situations. I know it's very important to feel the thump (sometimes), but it's also important to present a balanced sound that covers a room evenly. Loud, ultra low bass increases as it gets farther from the source, making it a muddled mess for listeners outside the immediate stage area. Every room is different, and sometimes, I agree that it's appropriate to pump the guts out of the bass, but I hardly ever play those types of rooms anymore. Even our dueling routine (which is kinda loud, and raucous sometimes) sounds better when the mix is more even. With no drums or bass, I like the bottom keys to really resonate with a presence, and clarity. Too much bass can cloud that result.
One reason I love the Bose systems is that the bass stays on the floor, where it is most effective, while the mids and highs (YES - Bose has lots of both!) are free to travel over the heads of the dancers to fill the room in all the nooks and crannies.
In the end, use what you love, of course, but take it from this old timer ... too much bass can detract from your mix, and takes away some of the cleanliness that we strive to provide in our arrangements. Just my 2 cents from how I hear it.

Your illustration, Dave, is the reason I am changing from my Bose for my upcoming dinner. Aside from constricted to six feet in a corner with my Bose telescoped over my head, all I could hear was loud bass, even though the guests, reportedly, did not experience the imbalance.
My point is that whether the bass could be adjusted internally is beside the point, as everything was balanced on KB before I left the house, and I don't want to fool with EQ at the job.

For this particular gig in a large hall, I need to hear everything, and dial my bass intensity and volume with a turn of a dial on my remote. This is in addition to stereo that is not confined to a sweet spot.

Thanks for your sage advice(NO tongue in cheek).

Bernie, when I was using the Bose L1 PAS system, which was the one I first heard Uncle Dave perform with, you could separately adjust the sub woofer, which was a nice feature. You cannot do that with the compact, but to be honest, I never really had to. The big thing with the compact was to be sure that the base unit, which contains the sub, was at least 3 feet, and preferably 5 or more feet from the wall behind you. If not, the bass would be overwhelming.

Hope this helps,

Gary

Hi Gary

Thanks, I am sure that was at least part of it, as I did not have that much clearance without putting the Bose out in front.

I frequently put the stick to my side, or in front. That's why I NEED on board monitor speakers. The Bose os for the house - the kb speakers are for me!

When I read the past thread on monitor speakers, I could see you handled the situation quite nicely. However, without KB speakers it requires more gear, but when necessary, it wouldn't require all that much. In my case, I now have an alternative in the SSv3 and Logitech.

I have two Logitech systems and I love them for small jobs. I keep one set up at home and the other in a duffle bag ala Gary Diamond.

Now you know why I get the big bucks,

Gary