I have both the Pa4x and the S 970 – to compare would be like comparing apples and pears. They both are able to do a great job but in a different way.

John C.

I think the early adopters are going to pave the way for a much cheaper and more competitive Genos. Can’t believe it’s 2k Aus $ more rrp than the top of the line Montage 7.
This is gouging the faithful, but if Yamaha Want To make inroads to a new audience they must price Genos closer to the PA4X Pro.

I mean the Genos “made in China”. Come on, no improve=e to a TCHellicon Voice Processor, even i’m Surprised about those two things. Honestly, I think the sounds etc on the Genos are fantastic, but I could never justify the current price, and I don’t think that’s only me.

So here’s hoping once the dust settles for a huge price reduction, Yamaha should learn from The a Korg Oasys exercise. Eventually the old faithful die off and you have to come back to reality.

how fair would a big price decrease be to all the initial purchasers who paid the original price ? ... would Yamaha be willing to rebate the difference in price to those initial buyers ? ... I doubt it ...

This is an excellent marketing comparison. Korg created a monster with Oasys. Everybody wanted one...not everyone could afford one. Plus, it was buggy.

Hence, Kronos was born and reached a much larger audience.

Yamaha could have done the same thing with Genos. They tapped the market with the Tyros line. Why not re-address their marketing and price it to allow a larger user base. Because of the pricing being the same as Tyros 5...people will continue to make the comparison. A lost opportunity for Yamaha.

From what I'm reading on other forums, the dealers can't get them in fast enough to fill all the pre-orders let along new orders that are coming in daily, and that's on a worldwide basis. Keep in mind that Yamaha is the largest musical instrument manufacturer in the world. I seriously doubt that they shot themselves in the foot with the Genos and its pricing. Only time will tell.

Gary

The number of sales proves this statement wrong...

There is way to many people prepared to pay this much money for a Genos.
Its more them €1000 expensive then the 76 key Montage, more so in the US
That was way more expemsive to build
And the only reason for that is so many people are prepared to pay big money for a Genos.

Initial sales for Yamaha are incredible
But how many will they sell next years christmass?

When it’s all said and done, Yamaha is proving that capitalism works. My local dealer (no longer working) never stocked the top of line Tyros due to it’s limited market. He also told me that there was a large profit margin built in for dealers to make a sizable gain.

This keeps the dealers happy and in business. So I guess it makes sense in the grand scheme of things.

So rather than get shot by my wife...I’ll stick with my lowly 970 until I find an estate sale where the family is trying to get rid of a Genos.

I’m also a believer in the free market economy, so hooray for Yamaha. But it still irks the poop out of me!!!

Many dealers who sell Clavinova are happy with the bigger margins. Back when the Tyros started to jump in MAP (minimum advertised price) those dealers were the drive in upping the profit margin.

I think the T3 price was $4299... When I was selling keyboards, I sold it for $3399 and still made a good profit. The owner sent me a message and said why do you sell it so low? I told them that we only sell one or two a year, and this was a guy is already a returning customer from the T2.

That’s the same thing that’s happening with the Genos right now. $5499 in the US is the minimum advertised price. If you advertise below that price, you could lose your dealership. So, once you get the customer into your store, you can start to have private conversations about what they are willing to pay. The dealer has to make a certain amount of profit overall in their business to stay in business. A Genos sale can be a huge payday for the salesman and the store. But you will be expected to do a lot of customer service with that sale.

I wonder how much it cost to actually make the Genos?!?
Developing… Sampling… Engineering… Programming… Manufacturing… Shipping from China🇨🇳 … Shipping from California to the rest of the USA…Yamaha Japan’s 🇯🇵 cut... Yamaha USA’s 🇺🇸 cut... Dealer’s cut... Everybody needs a piece of the Genos pie!! 🥧

Yamaha’s PSR E series and PSR S series are a much better bang for the buck. In my opinion, compared to the Genos, the PA4X is a much better bang for the buck.

In my mind, the Genos is very hard to justify $$$ wise. From a business standpoint, value for investment of TOTL arrangers, Genos would be at the bottom of the list of current TOTL arrangers. Based on what the Genos can provide, vs. other TOTL arrangers, I would think that Genos would be the least, not the most, expensive arranger.

However, if the heart, and not the head, were doing the deciding, I would think “Go for it”.

I’d love to own a Genos...might even take the plunge. I’m sure I’d love playing it. But I would buy it because it’s a want, not a need or even the best business decision for me.

Having played the E series several times, mainly because the local music store stocks them and they are just 10 minutes drive time from home, I would never purchase one. Sorry, they don't come remotely close to my aging PSR-S950 when it comes to overall sound and features. I guess that's why they are so inexpensive. The E series would be something I would buy my 10-year-old grandson for Christmas, but he wouldn't appreciate it as long as he has an I-pad in his grasp.

Now, if I were 20 years younger, knowing what I now know, I would have a Genos is a heartbeat. And, that would be a gigantic leap forward over my S-950, which I dearly love playing. The economics of it would be simple, at least for me. I would sound better while performing, which would translate to more jobs than I could possibly handle. But, like most on stage performers, I have always found it extremely difficult to turn down a job, even when it meant doing triples, which were brutal on this old man when I occasionally confronted them. Tearing down and setting up three times in a single day was just brutal, but what the Hell, I managed to survive this long.

Now, is the Genos better than the PA4X? I really don't know, mainly because I have not played either of them. Though, I have heard lots of great demos from the Genos and the PA4X, I NEVER rely solely on what I hear from demos. The demo merely shows us what a very, very talented arranger keyboard player can do - not what I can do using the same keyboard, which is the most important factor of whether or not I wish to upgrade. I do know that if I sound better, I will book more jobs, therefore making the upgrade cost effective.

The next part about the business aspect of the upgrade is the ability to write off the purchase of the keyboard as a capital equipment expenditure, which is still fairly easy to do, though if the new tax bill is passed, I'm not sure how this will be effected, though I do not believe it will have any impact. This will, of course, lower your adjusted gross income, thereby lowering your tax burden for that fiscal year.

Consequently, the only economic benefit would be if you were able to book more jobs because you sound better. Book more jobs, make more money, work more hours, keep the wife happy. Well, two out of three ain't all that bad. (Unfortunately, the keyboard cannot make me look better!) Donny used to boast that the keyboard would eventually pay for itself - nope - that cannot happen, but that would take too long to explain. The more performances you book, the cost per performance decreases, but it still NEVER pays for itself.

Bottom line, if you don't perform for a living, and just enjoy playing and sounding good, buy the damned thing. You only go around once and I don't know about you guys and gals, but I'm not leaving my money to the kids to piss away. Hell, they're already getting my sailboat, music gear and the house when my wife and I are dead. What more could they want?

All the best,

Gary