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#453065 - 06/03/18 01:45 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Bernie9]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By Bernie9
Donny and Jerryghr just opened my mind and ears. Both wonderful examples which I shall keep and refer to. Many have offered excellent advice, but to hear what you all are talking about opens a whole new world. In Donny's rendition, I can see playing off the blues scale. I often ad lib the melody staying in the structure of the scale, this isn't any different, just applied in another way.

It's funny how I have heard comping for 50 years but wasn't listening, because I wasn't trying to do it.

I once was blind and now I see(sort of).

Thanks all


Bernie I am glad we could help you as I always say Hearing it is so much better then just talking about it every time,
...good luck to you and your music

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#453066 - 06/03/18 01:49 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Jerryghr]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By Jerryghr
Hi Bernie,

I used to play along with the melody with the singing. Then I started comping and with a little practice it becomes easier to do and a lot less work while playing. Now I let the singer and the style do all the work while I throw in a few fills.

Here is an example with me noodling around (filling in the
holes) with Tyros sax.


https://www.dropbox.com/s/8r3ojeswxa50obt/September%20in%20The%20Rain.wav?dl=0

Regards,

Jerryghr


Jerry awesome job really done well....
I Love that song thanx for chiming in on this topic.

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#453073 - 06/03/18 07:06 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Dnj]
Jerryghr Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/14/02
Posts: 1497
Loc: Buffalo, NY
Thanks for listening and commenting fellas.

I would add one more piece of advice to the suggestions.

"Don' be afraid to make mistakes" the more you do it, the more second nature it becomes without thinking about it. Besides the dancers don't really hear the clinkers. If they do I just tell them I was playing jazz.

Glad I could contribute.

Jerryghr


Edited by Jerryghr (06/03/18 07:55 PM)

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#453086 - 06/04/18 01:39 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Bernie9]
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
Not sure if this is the right thread for this, or not. (please tell me, and I'll move it)
Lots has been said about individual playing styles, keyboard preferences, chord shapes, and much more. Here is my take on how I do what I do, and why.
It's important to state that I'm a singer first, and a keyboard/guitar player second ... tied very closely with my role as entertainer/emcee. With THAT said, let's begin.

Whether I'm sitting at a grand piano, or an arranger keyboard, my priorities are the same:
1) vocals
2)bass
3)rhythm
*)everything else (I call this fluff, or color)

My 2 hands generally split the duties of bass and chords, even on an acoustic piano. When playing full chordal accompaniment on a piano, I often rely on a heavy LH octave, or I-V-I to add depth to the chord structure. When playing an arranger, I go between triggering patterns, or playing live manual bass all night. Either way - I ALWAYS play the full chords with my RH, even if the arranger is set to automatic. This personalizes my styles so each one is always song specific. Playing manual bass is my preferred method with standards, and swing tunes, because it enables me to "kick" the rhythm section for emphasis. I can accent phrases, and lines with both hands acting together .... something that's often difficult, while relying on pre programmed styles. I have always believed that bass is the most important element to a rhythm section. Far more important than drums. It sets the key, fills out the fundamental, moves the air, so your gut can feel it, and provides the oooomph to make people (not me) dance. My user styles have been thinned out to remove the piano, and guitar sounds when they are playing most of the chords in a style. This frees up polyphony, and un-clutteres the accompaniment. Remember - I'm spotlighting the melody always. (in my case, my voice)

A typical, or signature sound for me is a simple trio style with a drum pattern, LH bass, RH Rhodes (sometimes layered), and voice on top with added harmonies to suit the style or genre I'm aiming for. Comping behind my vocals is easy in this config, because I'm usually surrounding the melody with the chords, so I can trigger my "freshman-esq" harmonies at will. Some songs get simple 3rd up harmony, some benefit form more complex structure, like Four Seasons, MIlls Bros etc.

For me, I'm happiest when the vocals shine, the bass is solid, the Rhodes is ringing like a bell (sorry Johnny B), and the rest of the band is sitting tightly in the pocket of the groove I'm laying down. This makes my sound less automated, less manufacturer specific, and frankly .... more interesting. (I hope)

The Korg PA series really makes life simple with the button controls on top. The ability to turn on slash bass chords, manual bass, chord sequencing, and turn acc parts on/off in a flash is vital to a fresh sound, for me. Happy to answer any questions about my approach, but I mainly just wanted to share a few thoughts with the gang. Enjoy, all.
_________________________
No longer monitoring this forum. Please visit www.daveboydmusic.com for contact info

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#453127 - 06/05/18 12:33 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Bernie9]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3228
Loc: Dallas, Texas
Hi Bernie,

I thought about your question when I saw this video. Hope it’s helpful

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PvKL-NZ9Gp8
_________________________
It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

www.youtube.com/channel/UCV94i--V-A8kZShmGTKyDOw

https://www.facebook.com/elgrupocache

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#453128 - 06/05/18 12:36 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: montunoman]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By montunoman
Hi Bernie,

I thought about your question when I saw this video. Hope it’s helpful

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PvKL-NZ9Gp8


clap headphone clap

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#453134 - 06/05/18 01:26 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Jerryghr]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3228
Loc: Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted By Jerryghr
Hi Bernie,

I used to play along with the melody with the singing. Then I started comping and with a little practice it becomes easier to do and a lot less work while playing. Now I let the singer and the style do all the work while I throw in a few fills.

Here is an example with me noodling around (filling in the
holes) with Tyros sax.

Nice rendition of a classic. Thanks for Sharing Jerry.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8r3ojeswxa50obt/September%20in%20The%20Rain.wav?dl=0



Added file as MP3

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mku5he0w8q0hod9/September%20in%20The%20Rain.mp3?dl=0

Regards,

Jerryghr


Very nice rendition. You inspired me to learn this tune. Thanks for sharing Jerry.


Edited by montunoman (06/05/18 01:41 PM)
_________________________
It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

www.youtube.com/channel/UCV94i--V-A8kZShmGTKyDOw

https://www.facebook.com/elgrupocache

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#453135 - 06/05/18 01:30 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Uncle Dave]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3228
Loc: Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted By Uncle Dave
Not sure if this is the right thread for this, or not. (please tell me, and I'll move it)
Lots has been said about individual playing styles, keyboard preferences, chord shapes, and much more. Here is my take on how I do what I do, and why.
It's important to state that I'm a singer first, and a keyboard/guitar player second ... tied very closely with my role as entertainer/emcee. With THAT said, let's begin.

Whether I'm sitting at a grand piano, or an arranger keyboard, my priorities are the same:
1) vocals
2)bass
3)rhythm
*)everything else (I call this fluff, or color)

My 2 hands generally split the duties of bass and chords, even on an acoustic piano. When playing full chordal accompaniment on a piano, I often rely on a heavy LH octave, or I-V-I to add depth to the chord structure. When playing an arranger, I go between triggering patterns, or playing live manual bass all night. Either way - I ALWAYS play the full chords with my RH, even if the arranger is set to automatic. This personalizes my styles so each one is always song specific. Playing manual bass is my preferred method with standards, and swing tunes, because it enables me to "kick" the rhythm section for emphasis. I can accent phrases, and lines with both hands acting together .... something that's often difficult, while relying on pre programmed styles. I have always believed that bass is the most important element to a rhythm section. Far more important than drums. It sets the key, fills out the fundamental, moves the air, so your gut can feel it, and provides the oooomph to make people (not me) dance. My user styles have been thinned out to remove the piano, and guitar sounds when they are playing most of the chords in a style. This frees up polyphony, and un-clutteres the accompaniment. Remember - I'm spotlighting the melody always. (in my case, my voice)

A typical, or signature sound for me is a simple trio style with a drum pattern, LH bass, RH Rhodes (sometimes layered), and voice on top with added harmonies to suit the style or genre I'm aiming for. Comping behind my vocals is easy in this config, because I'm usually surrounding the melody with the chords, so I can trigger my "freshman-esq" harmonies at will. Some songs get simple 3rd up harmony, some benefit form more complex structure, like Four Seasons, MIlls Bros etc.

For me, I'm happiest when the vocals shine, the bass is solid, the Rhodes is ringing like a bell (sorry Johnny B), and the rest of the band is sitting tightly in the pocket of the groove I'm laying down. This makes my sound less automated, less manufacturer specific, and frankly .... more interesting. (I hope)

The Korg PA series really makes life simple with the button controls on top. The ability to turn on slash bass chords, manual bass, chord sequencing, and turn acc parts on/off in a flash is vital to a fresh sound, for me. Happy to answer any questions about my approach, but I mainly just wanted to share a few thoughts with the gang. Enjoy, all.


Interesting approach UD. I’d like to get my LH bass lines together to be able to do what you do. Do use any auto accompaniment at all ( besides drums) when doing LH bass?
_________________________
It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

www.youtube.com/channel/UCV94i--V-A8kZShmGTKyDOw

https://www.facebook.com/elgrupocache

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#453137 - 06/05/18 01:53 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: Bernie9]
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 6703
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Left hand bass can take many forms. LHB for a jazz organist is quite different than say stride piano or even (solo) coctail piano. Except for some transcribed 'ragtime', it's hardly ever written down. That's because it's more a technique or playing style than it is what one would see in a normal piece of sheet music. I still think critical listening to a style that you like is the best way to learn this hard to define aspect of playing non-classical music. JMO.

chas
_________________________
"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#453139 - 06/05/18 02:03 PM Re: Comping My Own Vocals [Re: montunoman]
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
Originally Posted By montunoman
Do you use any auto accompaniment at all (besides drums) when doing LH bass?


I use many techniques when playing manual bass. With swing tunes, I use a walking style, similar to an organist's approach. With latin styles, I play lots of l-5.
Very rarely do I have the auto acc follow my right hand, but I do, sometimes. When I utilize the auto acc, it's mostly because I want to play a solo line with my right hand ... ie: Sleepwalk, or Last Date.
_________________________
No longer monitoring this forum. Please visit www.daveboydmusic.com for contact info

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