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#472537 - 07/08/19 03:02 PM Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201
Dnj Offline
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Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703

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#472555 - 07/08/19 07:52 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
girljam Offline
Member

Registered: 07/09/05
Posts: 246
Loc: FL
Thanks for sharing this Donny~. When I had to stop giggling, my 910 helped pay the bills with piano lessons, which I still do. I also have an upright piano, but for those students who are interested, and whom I feel have enough basic knowledge of chords and theory, I love introducing them to chording on my arranger keyboard! Somewhat of a lost art . . . I can tell you that none of my piano instructors ever taught me how to really CHORD! I do believe it is becoming a lost art, so I do teach it,, when applicable, to students who seem capable of appreciating it!
_________________________
Jill

PSR S970, PSR S910, ShureSM57 mics, and way too much misc.

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#472569 - 07/09/19 06:03 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2445
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
Donny
Thanks for postiice vid and very good playing The piano sound on the Genous sounds great and is very expressive. Like to know the name of the first tune. Sounds familar but I can't place it ?
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#472572 - 07/09/19 06:10 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: girljam]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2445
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
Originally Posted By girljam
Thanks for sharing this Donny~. When I had to stop giggling, my 910 helped pay the bills with piano lessons, which I still do. I also have an upright piano, but for those students who are interested, and whom I feel have enough basic knowledge of chords and theory, I love introducing them to chording on my arranger keyboard! Somewhat of a lost art . . . I can tell you that none of my piano instructors ever taught me how to really CHORD! I do believe it is becoming a lost art, so I do teach it,, when applicable, to students who seem capable of appreciating it!




Not sure what you mean by Chording ? Lost Art ?
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#472573 - 07/09/19 06:54 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Bill Lewis]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Jill & Bill you are both very welcome ....
I watched the whole video 2x and found it
exceptionally enjoyable also.
Taking online requests from around the world is so kool!
Here is another..




Edited by Dnj (07/09/19 06:56 AM)

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#472591 - 07/09/19 11:21 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
Dnj Offline
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Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703

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#472592 - 07/09/19 11:55 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Bill Lewis]
girljam Offline
Member

Registered: 07/09/05
Posts: 246
Loc: FL
Originally Posted By Bill Lewis
Originally Posted By girljam
Thanks for sharing this Donny~. When I had to stop giggling, my 910 helped pay the bills with piano lessons, which I still do. I also have an upright piano, but for those students who are interested, and whom I feel have enough basic knowledge of chords and theory, I love introducing them to chording on my arranger keyboard! Somewhat of a lost art . . . I can tell you that none of my piano instructors ever taught me how to really CHORD! I do believe it is becoming a lost art, so I do teach it,, when applicable, to students who seem capable of appreciating it!




Not sure what you mean by Chording ? Lost Art ?


I was mostly referring to piano teachers . . . I belong to a piano teachers forum, which I really love, but very few instructors will teach their students the basics of chording and progression of chords. I remember watching my father chord with his left hand on his old Hammond organ, and after he was done, I would sit down and copy what he did. My teachers frowned upon this type of playing!
Sure, they want their students to be able to read the chord in written notation, but most steer away from anything more than that.
I want my students to not only be able to read music, but also to learn to play by ear (if possible), follow and feel rhythms, and develop their own sense of style over time by using every tool available to them!
Again, this is just my opinion!
I sat down at my 970 today for awhile, no styles, no frills, just played some beautiful music . . . And I am grateful every day that I have the ability to do so, with or without any styles or backing tracks! I play what makes me feel good!!!

keys
_________________________
Jill

PSR S970, PSR S910, ShureSM57 mics, and way too much misc.

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#472597 - 07/09/19 01:26 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: girljam]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3228
Loc: Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted By girljam
Originally Posted By Bill Lewis
Originally Posted By girljam
Thanks for sharing this Donny~. When I had to stop giggling, my 910 helped pay the bills with piano lessons, which I still do. I also have an upright piano, but for those students who are interested, and whom I feel have enough basic knowledge of chords and theory, I love introducing them to chording on my arranger keyboard! Somewhat of a lost art . . . I can tell you that none of my piano instructors ever taught me how to really CHORD! I do believe it is becoming a lost art, so I do teach it,, when applicable, to students who seem capable of appreciating it!



I know what you mean. I really consider myself a “ chord” player. I don’t think it’s at all a lost art though, but do agree with you 100 percent about piano teachers not teaching chords, and how to practically apply them to music. I tried so hard to find a teacher to work on chord playing with my daughter and I had a really hard time finding a teacher that could or would teach how to play with chords / lead sheets/ comping..,
I could teach my daughter but she very resistant to my musical input so I’ve learned to back off. She can play classical violin very well and can play just fine with no sheet music, which makes my very proud. I do wish she did keep up with piano though...


Not sure what you mean by Chording ? Lost Art ?


I was mostly referring to piano teachers . . . I belong to a piano teachers forum, which I really love, but very few instructors will teach their students the basics of chording and progression of chords. I remember watching my father chord with his left hand on his old Hammond organ, and after he was done, I would sit down and copy what he did. My teachers frowned upon this type of playing!
Sure, they want their students to be able to read the chord in written notation, but most steer away from anything more than that.
I want my students to not only be able to read music, but also to learn to play by ear (if possible), follow and feel rhythms, and develop their own sense of style over time by using every tool available to them!
Again, this is just my opinion!
I sat down at my 970 today for awhile, no styles, no frills, just played some beautiful music . . . And I am grateful every day that I have the ability to do so, with or without any styles or backing tracks! I play what makes me feel good!!!

keys

_________________________
It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

www.youtube.com/channel/UCV94i--V-A8kZShmGTKyDOw

https://www.facebook.com/elgrupocache

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#472598 - 07/09/19 01:32 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3228
Loc: Dallas, Texas
My daughter had a piano teacher who was mainly classical but could also play well by ear, but this teacher insisted that playing with out notation is a gift, and can not be taught. I do not agree at all and really think the teacher did not know how to teach without notation. How I wish my daughter had found a teacher like you Jill!
_________________________
It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

www.youtube.com/channel/UCV94i--V-A8kZShmGTKyDOw

https://www.facebook.com/elgrupocache

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#472599 - 07/09/19 02:22 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Bill Lewis]
Tostie Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 162
Originally Posted By Bill Lewis
Donny
Thanks for postiice vid and very good playing The piano sound on the Genous sounds great and is very expressive. Like to know the name of the first tune. Sounds familar but I can't place it ?


Everglow by Coldplay ;-)

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#472600 - 07/09/19 02:55 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Tostie]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2445
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
Originally Posted By Tostie
Originally Posted By Bill Lewis
Donny
Thanks for postiice vid and very good playing The piano sound on the Genous sounds great and is very expressive. Like to know the name of the first tune. Sounds familar but I can't place it ?


Everglow by Coldplay ;-)



Yea I knew that !! LOL! Thanks , going to look it up.
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#472601 - 07/09/19 03:07 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2445
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
To all without the endless quotes.

Sounds like my piano teachers in College. No clue on popular music or anything that wasn't completley notated. They could sight read fly s*** from a score but couldn't jam on a Blues Progression.
For referance I would highly reccomend the book
"Piano Chords and Progressions by Duane Shinne. "
I've had many piano books and they bore me after a short time but this one is very simple and explains things in a concise manner. You will understand Chord Construction, Voicing, Extensions and Progressions in very little time. I wish I had this book years ago. I like it so much I just went looking for my copy to give you this name and couldn't find it so I just ordered another. Great referance and review even for advanced players. I would also suggest looking into the "Nashville" numbered system of notating chords. It will help you play easily in all twelve keys. Good playing
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#472602 - 07/09/19 04:12 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: girljam]
bruno123 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 4912
Loc: West Palm Beach, FL 33417
Jill, my favorite subject, chords. My wife who passed away in 1994 attended the School of Performing Arts, you would recognize the name Fame, there was a movie about the school. She played beautifully, sad to say she could not play without the music, unless she memorized the piece.

I started my journey with guitar. I studied with my first teacher for four years. After I spent my time searching for any teacher who knew more than I did. In 1987 I bought my first keyboard. (If my memory serves me right) I used all that I had learned with my guitar and brought it to the keyboard, the best thing I have ever done.

Part two: (smile) Chords and Chord Progression.

1-Chords are the basic harmony in all types of music.

2-Chord theory is important. You should be able to understand any chord, even if it is C13b9 sus4 #5. This is not a difficult learning.

3-If I am backing a singer or a solo instrument, chords and how they are played will effect notes they are singing or playing. Many years ago, a jazz singer asked if the accordion player would sit this one out. When I asked why she said; Accordion players normally voice their chords with the melody on top, which restricted her freedom to express what she was feeling.

4-Chords should be telling a story. It is that story that adds to a song. Chords are very important.

The above does nit normally apply to songs with three and four chords, but they could.

Jill, if you want the rest of the story please let me know.
John C.

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#472624 - 07/10/19 11:47 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
john smies Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/05/00
Posts: 1384
Loc: koudekerke, Holland.
the video at the start of this thread is an impressive highlighting of the great sound of the Genos, no doubt about it.
What has come to draw my attention over the last 12 months or more is the fact that more often than not performances on the Genos are INSTRUMENTAL rather than backing up vocals. EVen my highly proficient fellow countryman Rico mainly ( or solely?)does instrumental stuff on the Genos. Whereas quite a number of folks who use the keyboard as the band accompanying their vocals, e.g.
Don Mason, Uncle Dave, Donny,Scott Yee, etc. tend to go for the Korg PA4x or other arranger. Gary is a noticable exception here, loyal as he has been to Yamaha, and to his vocal chords...

regards
John


Edited by john smies (07/10/19 11:47 AM)

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#472625 - 07/10/19 12:12 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: john smies]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By john smies
the video at the start of this thread is an impressive highlighting of the great sound of the Genos, no doubt about it.
What has come to draw my attention over the last 12 months or more is the fact that more often than not performances on the Genos are INSTRUMENTAL rather than backing up vocals. EVen my highly proficient fellow countryman Rico mainly ( or solely?)does instrumental stuff on the Genos. Whereas quite a number of folks who use the keyboard as the band accompanying their vocals, e.g.
Don Mason, Uncle Dave, Donny,Scott Yee, etc. tend to go for the Korg PA4x or other arranger. Gary is a noticable exception here, loyal as he has been to Yamaha, and to his vocal chords...

regards
John


You are quite right John,....Playing as a pro arranger Kb artist
and being a singer is the total package and requires and exceptional skill.
When it is done right using both it sounds amazing....
but when done not so good it can leave a listener wondering what is going on confused1
It is definitely an squired skill that needs to be honed on stage performing in front of hundreds of people for many years to get it right and you will learn more each time after that.
Most shy away from singing or use some weird excuses not to.
I agree after using many many many kORG & Yamaha,
Ketron & Roland units...sure you can do it with them all if you know how...but, I have to tip the hat to KORG Pa4x for the
LIVE pro Arranger/Singer hands down it has it all. I've already had two of them.....
& who knows I just might go back for a third try. eek2
It is certainly the Total performance package.

Like it or not but just to prove a point,..
...Here is a short PA4x demo w/vocal using the KAOSS feature to change the rhythm mid stream I recorded with my last KORG Pa4x....

https://app.box.com/s/ueeuroicimykiuyant7ja07005tr012t

headphone


Edited by Dnj (07/11/19 07:34 AM)

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#472634 - 07/10/19 03:58 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2445
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
Damn donny That was GOOD !! Changing the Style was impressive. If I was in the market you could of sold me on a Korg
I think you should of kept it.
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#472636 - 07/10/19 04:05 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Bill Lewis]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By Bill Lewis
Damn donny That was GOOD !! Changing the Style was impressive. If I was in the market you could of sold me on a Korg
I think you should of kept it.


Bill... Thank you
Sometimes I still think about it... coffee
I started with Korg before arrangers were invented.... Kinda miss the PA4X...

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#472639 - 07/10/19 06:47 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
bruno123 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 4912
Loc: West Palm Beach, FL 33417
“Donny, -- I started with Korg before arrangers were invented.... Kinda miss the PA4X...

Me to, John C.

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#472640 - 07/10/19 07:53 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
I don't miss it. I alternate it with Roland EA7, depending on my mood. smile
_________________________
DonM

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#472641 - 07/10/19 08:26 PM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: DonM]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By DonM
I don't miss it. I alternate it with Roland EA7, depending on my mood. smile


Don I said "kinda" wink

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#472647 - 07/11/19 03:47 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: john smies]
Tostie Offline
Member

Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 162
Originally Posted By john smies

What has come to draw my attention over the last 12 months or more is the fact that more often than not performances on the Genos are INSTRUMENTAL rather than backing up vocals.


Trust me, you don't want to hear this fellow countryman sing. eek

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#472650 - 07/11/19 07:15 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Dnj]
girljam Offline
Member

Registered: 07/09/05
Posts: 246
Loc: FL
Fantastic Donny, as usual! Love the style change!
Yesterday while I was perusing my old desktop hard drive, I ran across a few of my very first attempts at recording when I had my first arranger, the 2100. Boy, I have come a long way, but considering I did not have much expertise with an arranger, they really weren’t that terrible, lol.

Hoping to record some things in the near future, I see most of you are using box or YouTube to share recordings . . .
_________________________
Jill

PSR S970, PSR S910, ShureSM57 mics, and way too much misc.

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#472652 - 07/11/19 07:18 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: Bill Lewis]
girljam Offline
Member

Registered: 07/09/05
Posts: 246
Loc: FL
Thanks Bill for the info , I may just order that book! Sometimes I see or read things that help me not only in my own playing, but give me ideas on how to best teach an idea or concept to others. I am familiar with the Nashville system, just don’t teach it at the moment.
Play on!
_________________________
Jill

PSR S970, PSR S910, ShureSM57 mics, and way too much misc.

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#472653 - 07/11/19 07:28 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: girljam]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By girljam
Fantastic Donny, as usual! Love the style change!

Hoping to record some things in the near future, I see most of you are using box or YouTube to share recordings . . .


Thanx Jill for the listen,...I just wanted to experiment with the KAOSS feature on my then KORG Pa4x unit with that song to see where it would go,...so many things can be achieved with all the great features on the KORG PA4x eg: KAOSS etc, if you take your time to learn them and open your mind to new ways of creating music,singing etc.
That said, I look forward to some of your work also...
have a great day !

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#472654 - 07/11/19 07:29 AM Re: Live Arranger Keyboard & Piano playing | 07-07-201 [Re: bruno123]
girljam Offline
Member

Registered: 07/09/05
Posts: 246
Loc: FL
Originally Posted By bruno123
Jill, my favorite subject, chords. My wife who passed away in 1994 attended the School of Performing Arts, you would recognize the name Fame, there was a movie about the school. She played beautifully, sad to say she could not play without the music, unless she memorized the piece.

I started my journey with guitar. I studied with my first teacher for four years. After I spent my time searching for any teacher who knew more than I did. In 1987 I bought my first keyboard. (If my memory serves me right) I used all that I had learned with my guitar and brought it to the keyboard, the best thing I have ever done.

Part two: (smile) Chords and Chord Progression.

1-Chords are the basic harmony in all types of music.

2-Chord theory is important. You should be able to understand any chord, even if it is C13b9 sus4 #5. This is not a difficult learning.

3-If I am backing a singer or a solo instrument, chords and how they are played will effect notes they are singing or playing. Many years ago, a jazz singer asked if the accordion player would sit this one out. When I asked why she said; Accordion players normally voice their chords with the melody on top, which restricted her freedom to express what she was feeling.

4-Chords should be telling a story. It is that story that adds to a song. Chords are very important.

The above does nit normally apply to songs with three and four chords, but they could.

Jill, if you want the rest of the story please let me know.
John C.



Would love to hear the rest of your story! I am very familiar with NY School of Perf. Arts, my sister almost went there!! Ah yes, chords and harmonies.... one of FAV topics as well. I also sing and perform with a female acapella chorus. . . . And it is never MORE evident when is chord is discordant than when you are singing without music behind you!!!
Was considering becoming an arranger for barbershop groups . . .
PM me anytime!

]


Edited by girljam (07/11/19 07:30 AM)
_________________________
Jill

PSR S970, PSR S910, ShureSM57 mics, and way too much misc.

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