I spent a couple hours listening and comparing "Hammond" organ sounds.
Genos, SD90, and Hammond model. These are illustrated in the posted video..

I listened to all the organs in Genos including optional packs.

I would not want to play the Genos as a naked organ..

Compared to the Hammond (best), and the SD90 (very good).. the Genos is very bright, it doesn't have the Hammond warmth.. it is too digital.

I found it more suited to sounding like a transistor Lowery or Thomas.
Organ players would know what I am talking about.
I also think Yamaha makes it too hard to get to drawbars.

I am wondering if the SX900 or Tyros5 are as weak in "Hammond" sounds..

Still no hands on to verify my opinion, but usually YouTube is pretty true with sounds.

Acoustic Piano, and the new Sax sound good..

I got to hook up with Donny and try hands on.. If he doesn't leave me alone in the sandbox again

Yamaha have never made good Hammond emulations, however the Genos is the best so far.
The SD9 is also quite good.
If you want the best emulation (And you don't want to go for a genuine organ model)in an arranger, (And that is currently still available) then the Korg is top notch, with the PA4x being really top notch.

Bill

Bill the PA4X organs do sound good.

I have a Pa4x and a Genos. Pa4x organs are tough to beat, the Genos in the Hammond emulation is fair.

I always thought my Thomas Celebrity Royale organ was super, especially with the real Leslie they built in.
But of course the real Hammond will be the best...even though it wasn't clean and that's the way they were...those tube circuits and rotating wheels, were unique...just depends on what you like I guess.
Lee

The video Fran posted is by a Bosnian guy called Tiho. He has some of the best videos for arranger players I have seen. He has had all of the major arrangers and describes what he likes and doesn't like about each brand in a very objective manner. Since he uses all brands, he doesn't have a "dog in the hunt." Like our resident expert Don Mason, he says the PA4X is the best all around, but he likes the Genos and SD90 for other reasons. Check him out if you haven't already. A bit of a language barrier, but worth it IMO.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6Kmqz-zLDY3cEkTMxc5TnQ

Not a Major negative at all....I have owned them all, played them all, watched all the so called "expert analysis"
A/B senseless factoryish comparisons when you can easily adapt, edit, tweak, the sounds and styles into
any way you want it to sound, for any genre of music on all these arrangers.
This is why I chose Genos last for me.
When does the Negativity Stop & the Music Begin?

Donny why take opinions so personal?

You can tweak all day long and never get the "Hammond" sound.

Clones have tried for years.

"Real" Hammond players (not me), will know this will not do..

Nothing wrong in giving heads up to Hammond people.

I was surprised the "Hammond" was not great.

Listen to a BK9 again(no longer available), Integra7, PA4X (again)..
Ketron (any).

I am sure it makes no difference in your style or use, but die hard Hammond players will shake their head.

And just how many so called die hard Hammond "arranger players" do we have here?

On the video the Genos sounds like a cheap 70s organ , the EQ setting isnt right , the drawbars are not on the same level , he dont play the exact same notes a.
Having so much equipment and producing such a bad sounding movie make me think . . . .

I

+1

Every arranger had stronger and weaker points.
We all know that.
We all have different needs.
As a guitar player I find Roland guitars the weakest and unacceptable for me.
The organs in the Genos are more than sufficient for me.
However I bought this amazing expansion pack on sale for $30 on the Yamaha website.

Organ Session

Big difference. And I am happy.

Here is another one:

Organ Live

Eric

Sounds great to me with the right settings and expression pedal.



Jerryghr

Fran, appreciate you, but the title of the post says it all. I knew exactly where the replies were going to go.

The first MAJOR NEGATIVE on Genos. The tittle set the mood of defense.

Sorry, just my opinion,
I still like and respect what you’re about, John C.

Jerry oh yes Buddy ....@ 9:00...sounds great !

I gotta add another one pennies worth To this thread. I’ve written this elsewhere, if someone put a gun to my head and said mister, ya can’t have both it’s either Genos or Pa4x. I’d say OK the Pa4x goes. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. In my estimation the organs aren’t a negative they may not just sound as good as the Pa4x.

Hey guys the negative was not initiated by me, I passed (video) a player that owns all, and the negative was "Hammond" sound... Not Genos sounds.

You have heard other Knowing people here.. Bill confirming Yamaha was never a good "Hammond" sound. (Don't forget they are competitors).

Stephen said his PA4X was hard to beat for "Hammond" sound.. His Genos is "fair".

Now that you are forcing the coming Hammond players comments... hold on to your drawbars.

The guy that did the video... knows his stuff, and also likes "his" Genos.. He offered his experience on his own gear about a single topic..

Get over it.. If it is good enough for you.. Be happy

John be aware I posted another's opinion … By someone in position to comment.. I have never seen , let alone play a Genos

Eric, I also do not care for Roland guitars except the SN jazz guitar.

But I don't play guitar

DonM says he likes the lowly E-A7 guitars..

Hey you guys wanted Yamaha's best arranger ever.. you got it and like we always say.. No keyboard is perfect


Just to refresh your minds..

I like some of the EA7 guitars. Selection of good presets is limited. You can edit them and "make your own". I like the Korg guitars a lot. Yamaha guitars are probably best because of all the presets they make for you.
Ketron guitars are very good too.
Organs...in my opinion the BK9 was much the best. EA7 also very good. Korgs are good. I don't use them all that much so not a huge deal to me. I don't like that the Yamaha preset organ sounds, other than the drawbars, don't do the leslie on/off correctly.

I wonder what a WERSI Pegasus sounds like? Hmmm

One sound doesn't make an arranger kb..

I HAVE GENOS PAX4 AND NORD ELECTRIC 4 , AND THINK THAT THE ONLY NEGATIVE IN GENOS IS THE HAMMOND , NOT SO IN THE SOUND ALTHOUGH THE SOUND IS NOT TOP NOTCH , BUT IN THE LESLIE. THE HAMMOND IN PAX4 IS BETTER BUT ALSO NOT GOOD ENOUGH , EVEN NORD IS ONLY OKAY , THE BEST ARE HAMMOND AND CRUMER.

Pardon my ignorance, but as far as I could hear and see by the video, he is using the manufacturers preset sounds named 'RockOrgan'.
Also he pointed out that it is differences regarding soundcards, processing and outputs.

Yes, in this case Genos was clearly different from Hammond and Ketron, but so is it if we listen to diffrenet artists recordings / concerts where 'RockOrgan' sounds being used.
If add extra soundpacks it does wonders, but if work with drawbar settings and more, would it be possible to mix it up to sound a bit closer than it does in this 'demo'?

To compare products is fun and very interesting, but the sounds played here is not all the same preset 'Hammond RockOrgan' samples, so why should it sound perfectly equal as the big H? 🤔

I'd say if you want a Hammond sound
just BUY a real Hammond & be done with it,..not an arranger kb..
and if not I don't think anyone will come up to you with your KORG, Genos, Roland, Ketron,Nord, or whatever and say
"Hey that is not a Hammond"!!!..this could be said for every instrument sound on any electronic keyboard, ...
if it ain't the real thing although close it just will
not sound exactly like it.

Personally, not into organs, but what I do love about Yamaha keyboards is the extras you can purchase, if one wishes to do so.

I don't know why the piano and organ are singled out. There are 1,710 instrument voices on the Genos that don't sound exactly like the real instrument.
I rarely use the organ sound at gigs. Maybe a samba and a rare request for the 3 Sons.

Jerry

Made this video a year ago .

https://youtu.be/1FHdjg5A7wE

Now I have a NORD 5D , even better

I,

+1

Why? Because the staple sounds for any keyboard are Acoustic Piano, Electric Piano, Drums, Bass, Guitar, Sax and Organ

I too think a good Leslie sound is important, even playing to people that may not be familiar with the original Hammond sound. I use organ a lot, and through the years, the comments on the sound seem proportional to the quality of the Leslie, even when the sounds are not great. There is a reason why so many took to that inimitable swirling motion in the first place, but you have to have the interaction of the drum and horns to pull it off. That is where the wannabes fail.

Is possible to install ones favorite Organs or pianos etc through Sampling into the Genos?...Harold

Harold for a basic tone.. Yes.

The problem a Hammond sound has many inflexions, and how they interact when played.. You would need several layers, velocity switched, for each note and control by the user to switch the layers.

It is much to deep and the samplers of any keyboard will not do the job.

There are several good software (VST) available.. A better choice than adding a multi sample on a Genos or any keyboard.

Sorry, I don’t understand.

If you want the Hammond organ sound..,,,

Why not buy a Hammond organ?

The arranger keyboard is a jack of all trades that can emulate all types of instruments without buying any other instruments, therefore having to buy a Hammond Organ in adition to the arranger keyboard defeats what the arranger keyboard is about.

Bill

Thanks Fran...It gives Me a better understanding...So the VST's are the way to go...I still don't understand the process...Never had any experience in any of this...Sincerely, Harold

Yamaha never had good b3 sounds..
They all sound typically Yamaha..

If you want great B3 sounds in your Genos,
There are a few 3rd party expansions with very good sampled B3 sounds..

Apparently, most of you have audiences that can distinguish a B3 sound?

Back in the 60’s, we had a rock band...we fronted some major acts at the time.

The keyboardist used a Hammond B3...a real b...., to move.

We reunited for a concert in 2007. All of us were retired...had more $$$....bought better instruments than we had in the 60’s.

The keyboardist for our band bought a Hammond B3 portable organ. Sounded good to me.

When "rating" organ sounds, I think the largest part of the tone os actually the Leslie (or sim). Years ago, I heard a DX7 through a wooden Leslie, and it was spot on. The DX uses sine waves, so it was easy to understand. What was missing was the dynamic percussion allocation, but still great.
My biggest "WTF" moment came when my band was doing an affair in a hotel in Philly. On our break, we wandered around, visiting the other banquet rooms and heard the best organ trio sound ever coming from down the hall. When we looked in the room, it was a CORDOVOX, drummer, and sax ... but he was pumped into a Leslie 122. Both instruments sounded "real" to me, and my bandmates.

So, my point is this: the tone is a 2 part symbiosis - each part compliments the other to produce the sound we have come to know and love as that "Hammond" sound. For what it's worth, my PA4x totally satisfies my need for any "B3ing" I need. Back in the day, I needed the actual beast to do the deeds, but in my small studio, in my quiet apartment, I am very happy with the emulations I get with digital recreations.
SV-1 is my Rhodes
PA4x is my organ
Pianos are abundant in almost everything else I use, but my new favorite is the SX900 played with the keys of the SV1 through midi.