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#489725 - 02/20/20 09:48 AM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: cgiles]
tony mads usa Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/16/02
Posts: 14376
Loc: East Greenwich RI USA
Originally Posted By cgiles
Originally Posted By tony mads usa
One fact that I feel is missing from chas' post is the fact that working professionals - stage musicians, studio guys, and the like - are playing with other MUSICIANS and therefore don't need a machine to play drums, bass lines, etc. ...


For me, one mark of a 'professional' is that they CAN play with other musicians. The machine plays it's part precisely, consistently, and predictably, no matter WHAT YOU'RE PLAYING. Good musicians, especially in jazz but also in other forms, play to complement what the OTHER musicians are playing; in other words, they are listening and responding in real time. It's going to be awhile before AI catches up to that.

chas


Totally agree ...
_________________________
t. cool

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#489728 - 02/20/20 10:55 AM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: DannyUK]
124 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/01/09
Posts: 2195
If you prefer to play with other musicians, then you can do just that. Just switch into full keyboard mode, turn off any backings, choose your favourite piano voice and away you go - a 76-note board obviously preferred. Then, when you feel like it, play around in full arranger mode. Choices, indeed. That's why I'd rather have an arranger, I can play what I like when I like. And, as DannyUK says, it's about having fun.

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#489742 - 02/20/20 12:50 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: DannyUK]
lahawk Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 2789
Loc: Lehigh Valley, Pa.
I guess I'm #6 in loving the SX-900.
My last Yamaha arranger was the PSR-3000, so this was a major step up for me.
_________________________
Larry "Hawk"

♫ 🎹🎹 ♫ SX-900




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#489743 - 02/20/20 01:02 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: lahawk]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By lahawk
I guess I'm #6 in loving the SX-900.
My last Yamaha arranger was the PSR-3000, so this was a major step up for me.


Larry what are your dislikes and likes since you upgraded to sx900..?

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#489744 - 02/20/20 01:02 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: lahawk]
jingleman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/02/05
Posts: 1297
Loc: The Villages, FL, USA
To me...the SX900 represents a significant upgrade from its predecessors. Between mod wheel and pitch bend, there’s more than enough expression to add realism to solo voices. Plus the fact that anyone buying a psr keyboard already accepts the fact that there is no aftertouch...never has been.
I guess that makes me lucky #7.
jingleman

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#489765 - 02/20/20 01:56 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: Dnj]
zuki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 4724
Originally Posted By Dnj
Originally Posted By cgiles
Originally Posted By Bernie9
If you leave to many parts in, you lead the audience to believe you are not really playing.


I'm no psychoanalyst but this seems to be a recurring theme among arranger players. Why do you suppose that is? Is it because they're afraid people (audiences) may not think they're real musicians? Why do arranger players buy expensive keyboards and spend hours in preparation while big-name 'pro's' use backing tracks. Why is it SO important to convince people that you're 'actually playing' a musical instrument. The very sounds coming out of an arranger keyboard would indicate to all but an idiot that you're not ('cause it's not possible to play drums, piano, horns, strings, bass, and guitar, at the same time - unless you're a very talented octopus). Furthermore, arranger music will only work in certain types of venues. It will NOT work in a concert hall, a jazz club, a rock concert/club, a church (although some try to force-fit it into some churches -probably none with over 100 members), or high-end hotels or casinos. Why? For one thing, in places where people spend a LOT of money, they want to hear LIVE music (or what they consider 'live music'). For another, the management won't hire them.

Despite the opinion of a small group of aficionados, the reason (legitimate or not) Arrangers are not that popular within the broader musical community is that most serious musicians, especially trained professionals, don't consider them a legitimate instrument. This rankles arranger enthusiasts but is nonetheless true. I think their thinking is that 'if you didn't work for it, it's worthless' (meaning, of course, the years of study and practice to learn and master your instrument).

I know that this argument/discussion will go on forever and be repeated endlessly with each iteration generating it's share of animosity, but the truth is whatever each individual thinks it is, and nobody is right or wrong.

BTW, I agree with John Smies; why would one spend large sums of money to (poorly) duplicate something that already exists. The whole point of an Arranger (at least in my mind) is to PERSONALIZE it. Oh well, different strokes......

chas


Chas +1... that was a Brilliant Post that I totally agree with
on all levels,...so well said and so true!! clap
I suggest people should read this entire post at least three times and let it sink in deep. cool2


Oh please! Why don't we have an arranger jam and we can all throw our boards in a big bon fire.
_________________________
Live: Korg PA4X/EV Everse 8s/Senn 935/K&M stand

Studio: Korg PA4X/Yamaha DGX670/Nord 6D73/Boss BR900CD/Tascam DP24SD/MTM Iloud/Sony C80/AGK 214/ATEM Mini Pro switcher/K&M stand

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#489767 - 02/20/20 01:59 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: zuki]
tony mads usa Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/16/02
Posts: 14376
Loc: East Greenwich RI USA
Originally Posted By zuki

Oh please! Why don't we have an arranger jam and we can all throw our boards in a big bon fire.


Nah, I like mine too much ... keys
_________________________
t. cool

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#489772 - 02/20/20 02:13 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: DannyUK]
Bernie9 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/02
Posts: 5520
Loc: Port Charlotte,FL,USA
So the the pro OMBs do some little right hand "EMBELLISHMENTS" and let the machine do everything else. Give me a break.
_________________________
pa4X 76 ,SX900, Audya 76,Yamaha S970 , vArranger, Hammond SK1, Ketron SD40, Centerpoint Space Station, Bose compact

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#489777 - 02/20/20 02:23 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: Bernie9]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Pretty much Bernie take away the left hand accompaniment or shut it off and see what you're left with... don't get me wrong I love arranger keyboards but they have their limits and you have to be honest with yourself to realize that they have been good to me throughout the years I can't complain about that but they have their limitations..

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#489781 - 02/20/20 02:36 PM Re: PSR SX900 Downfall [Re: Dnj]
bruno123 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 4912
Loc: West Palm Beach, FL 33417
Yes the arranger keyboards do have limitations, they have always been short of perfection. Where the focus should be is on our limitations, now that would be a great subject.

John C.

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