Hi all,I'm just wondering is there a specific rule of thumb to keep to when in a style editing window, in so that you bring internal drum kit to 63 and bass around 40,
the arrangers volume level sliders where should these be set,I did a little editing and had all the arranger levels up full, then needed more volume to the drums with nothing to give, so if there is a general guide to setting your arrangers volume levels, please share with me, I suppose the most important is your drums and bass, thanks in advance for any advice and help,I have seen people keep volume levels in the middle, but one night I saw a guy give a little tweak to his drums and the drums just went crazy loud altogether,so when editing is wise to keep arranger levels to the top, middle or just below the top? I hope I'm making sense..

Where are the factory styles set to?

On the whole, most manufacturers carefully gain stage their styles to give the best signal to noise ratio while allowing for quite a bit of headroom. On the whole, you would be well advised to match your style editing to their standards…

Thank you so so much for your advice, in fact I never would have thought of this, and what you advise makes a whole lot of sense,
just for example here's a quick rundown on my procedure,
I find a factory style I like and I want to change it to my own liking,
So I hit view edit window and drive my arranger levels up full and in the edit window I bring the internal drum level to 63, and you know writing it here now in text to you I see my mistake,
So to get it right once and for all
Your saying to select a style from its factory presets and take note in
its edit window of the internal volume level settings for the drums bass etc, and set my arranger levels to suit, and use this setting for every style I want to edit and save to my registrations so to avoid volume changes between each style while especially playing live lol,
nothing worse and more embarrassing
giving headroom is another very important factor, more volume on just the drums it's there, the way I was going about it, I would have had no more to give,
have you any factory style in mind I could work off of to use as a starting point, I'm sorry for all the questions as I'm totally confused right now with all this and it's so time consuming, editing all the different parts, intros endings and A B C D, everything done and saved and gone to registration, go and play another style from the factory styles adjust the arranger levels then return to the style you just saved and it's either way too low or too high, oh god give me patience,and the funny thing is once I get the hang of this, ill probably say sure that was easy lol, but yeah it's easy when you know how, thank you very much for answering my post,
await your reply again if you can picture and make sense of all the above 🙄😉

On the whole, you want to be able to freely select your own styles or factory styles without worrying about volume jumps.

So matching them to each other makes common sense. Remember, the total headroom of the final output doesn’t just take the style’s output but also whatever you want to play on top of it as well, so jacking the style up reduces overall headroom…

However, remember that a sound’s perceived volume is a combination of how loud the volume is set, PLUS how much velocity each note is set to. You might want to take a look in the edit window of a factory style at what range the velocities of the parts tend to fall into, then look at your styles and see if they are similar. Perhaps you have a very light touch, perhaps a very heavy one… You might find yourself needing to either drop the volume or raise it from where the factory styles are if the velocities differ by much.

Comparison by ear is the only real way to get a match… and don’t forget, a nice quiet ballad style will probably need to be a bit quieter than a heavy rock style! Otherwise, you are back to having to grab the volume or balance knob if you are selecting styles on the fly!

OMG!! you went out of your way to try and explain to me, and it's a lot clearer to me now, driving my arranger volume sliders up full was definately totally and complete madness and stupid, headroom to go up or down is of most importance and your right the ear is a way to go
I may be better off setting up my pa system when doing this than studio monitors,I'll let you know how it all goes, thank you so much.

Those guys at the factory know what they are doing, LOL 😂

Yeah your 100% correct,
the Arranger is just a tool, well I think I have got the hang of it changed some styles and saved to registration abd renamed and ready to rock sounding great through one of my Dynacord 5 speakers so the full set bins and all are going up tomorrow night, so hopefully all goes well, I kept the arranger sliders just around half way and tweaked internal a little, I'll get to the gig early enough maybe do a little more tweaking, so fingers crossed, thanks guys for your very much valued help

One thing I’d like to see on arrangers is fader scaling…

That is, the ability to set up what range the full motion of the fader affects the volume (or whatever parameter is assigned to it) of the sound. You are right that sometimes, small movements of the fader are hard to judge accurately while in the heat of playing and you can sometimes get WAY more of a Part than you intended trying to make a small increase.

Being able to set up a ‘live use’ fader scale might allow you to set up say a 10 point volume increase in the travel that would normally, at full scale, get you a 30+ increase. This would make subtle changes easier to perform live, when you don’t have time to rest your hand before you make an adjustment.

Kurzweil’s could do this (probably still can, but I haven’t used a new one lately) and it came in really handy…

I feel all this stuff you guys are doing keeps you away from player better. (Your chops) But I need to be honest – in my younger days I was doing the same thing. (smile) Oh Well!

Enjoy, John C.

What stuff, Bruno? Unbalanced styles won’t help your chops!

My take has always been, the more attention you pay to making sure the technical side of things is PERFECT with no more than one button push on the gig, the more time you have to spend on your chops and presentation being perfect as well. But having to fiddle with knobs, buttons and sliders while you play can only detract from your attention to your playing chops.

My goal has always been to minimize my interaction with the technology and maximize my attention to just being musical and entertaining. If that takes time at home, I don’t allow that time to take away from my chops practice. I just add to the overall time I take..! 🎹😎

Thanks Diki, you sound like my father.

My thought was a general thought about technical stuff.
And I do know what I am talking about.
John C.

Well Diki I fully agree with every word you said, less tweaking of buttons the better in live performance, speaking of performance
perhaps this is the wrong place, but I'm looking for a style for my audya 5, ( pet shop boys it's a sin) any idea where I would get this

AJ might know. And we have a Ketron forum here he moderates, so a post there would probably get prompt attention…

Hi Diki, again I have to say less tweaking of buttons and sliders the better for live performance, I just bought the Audya pop styles from Darren at ketron uk and although requires song and style upgrade 2011 showing the blue dot , the styles worked perfect, absolutely amazing on my Audya 5
O.S 5.3D release
even though it did not have that req
upgrade but the blue A, 2010 upgrade,
Well worth purchasing the pop pen drive,so easy to perform with, all you have to do is learn the lyrics and play the chords,
I see now there's a 2012 song and style upgrade, but do I have to upgrade to 2011 firstly before upgrading to 12,
Perhaps I should have started a new post, but its all related to getting the best sounds from the Audya 5 to have that perfect Performance,so where do I go from here, upgrade or just leave alone as is, what's your opinion, actually what is the latest song and style upgrade for the Audya

I don’t use Ketron’s, I’m a longtime Roland user.

I do like Ketron’s audio drums, they do impart an very ‘live’ feel, but the price you pay is the inability to take the drums, and substitute a different kit, or edit the drum track to correct perhaps a detail that doesn’t work with the song you are working on, nor can you import it into a DAW via MIDI for extensive detail editing.

For instance, one of the first things I do to an arranger capture in a DAW is tweak the fills so they aren’t all IDENTICAL, which is one of the major giveaways that it isn’t a drummer playing!

But as long as the drums work well for a song you are performing live, Ketron’s are hard to equal for a great live band sound…

Technical questions about detailed issues might be better posted on the Ketron sub forum, where it is likely either AJ (the moderator) or other actual Ketron users can help you… 🎹😎