I'm looking for an Instrument Definition for a Roland BK-9.

This is an .ins file.

I don’t recall ever finding one. You might have to create it yourself 😱

I guess I'll have no choice.

It was an exceedingly rare keyboard, Dengi. There simply aren’t the kind of resources available that you would find for say a S900 or a PA4x.

You’ve already found out how to find the CC00/32/PC for each Tone and Drumkit, but do you have the manual with the complete Tone and DK Lists? They have all the Tones listed by name and 00/32/PC…

Roland probably sold 1000 Fantom’s for every BK9. Those are the kind of keyboards that someone goes to the trouble of creating an INS file for.

Don’t forget, if you have the KBD Part 1&2/MFX/EQ Link ON (it is by default) what you hear when you call up a UPR KBD sound isn’t JUST the bare sound, but the sound with an associated ROM MFX and possibly some EQ. So if you’re calling up Tones with your DAW, unless directed to the UPR1/2 KBD Parts, those insert effects don’t get added and the patch might sound VERY different from the sound if you call it up for UPR1/2 on the keyboard.

Diki, I hear you, loud and clear . Sadly there isn't much resources out there. Yes I do have the Tone List. I had to create a chart on Excel and manually I typed in all the C00, C32, PC numbers, plus I had to convert C0 and C32 to Bank numbers, since the DAW needs Bank and Patch numbers.

The thing is, there are a zillion different banks, and they don't go by Tone Group, for example one bank might contain piano, organ, fx or whatever. I manually have to group all the tones that belong to each bank. The Tone list is in Tone Group order, but not in Bank order. So 1700 or so tones, are being combed meticulously and reordered in banks.



And yes, I'm aware of the MFX and the EQ not being called up by the DAW, but that's why I will start the recording with the BK-9's onboard sequencer, with the desired tones selected on Up1 or Up2, and then move things over to the DAW. Of course this would work if I don't change the Tone down the line on Up1 or Up2.

Yeah, What you are doing is definitely more the strong point of a workstation. I tend to keep things inside the arranger as much as possible, except for editing in the DAW.

The Makeup Tools are FAR more powerful that your DAW for fine tuning certain aspects of the sequence. I usually made a point of transferring the sequence BACK to the BK9 for final adjusting, and adding MFX to Song Parts that could benefit, EQ etc.

And, quite honestly, there are SO many sounds in the BK, calling them up using an instrument definition file doesn’t really help! I couldn’t name a dozen sounds off the top of my head!

Interesting thought… never tried this myself, but theoretically (if you set up the MIDI stuff right) wouldn’t calling a Tone up from the keyboard (on a Keyboard Part) automatically send the 00/32/PC code out? If you set up a track in Camewalk that then echoes JUST the 00/32/PC on its new channel, wouldn’t that then set the DAW track to the same Tone as you just used on the KBD Part?

I hardly ever found the .ins files very useful. It’s been so many years since anything had so few sounds that I could remember the names. I know it sounds like a great idea, but in practice, not so much. Make sure BEFORE you spend a ton of time doing this that you really know your entire ROM by name well enough for it to be useful…

I have been searching the Internet high and dry for an IDF file for the BK9 for years, I too don't believe one exists...

The problem I found with using song makeup tools to modify parts of a song is that it doesn't reflect back to the actual midi file... so each time you go back to the midi file to edit something or record some new data - all your song makeup edits are reset. And you have to start all over again. Unless I have missed something or there is a better way to do it?

All your Makeup edits are to be found in a big chunk of sysex at the start of the SMF. But, being sysex, it is channel specific and can’t be rechannelized by changing the output channel on a DAW. Best practice is to not change channels on Song Parts.

There is also a ‘Freeze’ function, that changes the edits to their final form, but it only works for stuff like CC values, transpositions, velocity offsets and stuff like that. You can’t really use it on MFX edits, drumkit edits and the like. Those are sysex no matter what.

One of the primary differences between Roland arrangers and some others is that there are no ‘User Tones’. So if you want to use an edited Tone, or edit its MFX etc, there’s nowhere to store it so a sequence can recall it all in one go. Roland chose simplicity of live operation over studio complexity (the opposite of Korg!). It makes it easier for casual users but more of a PITA for advanced users!

My workflow in the past used to mostly be use the Recorder to ‘capture’ the arranger Parts but don’t play a Keyboard Part (chord recognition works even with the Parts turned off). And to get the best capture, slow down the tempo as far as you can and then speed it back up, which makes any slight timing problems MUCH smaller!

Then transfer to the DAW, do any edits there (change the notes for more variety, whatever) then record YOUR Parts, focus on the notes, not the perfect sound (that comes later!). When finished, transfer BACK to the arranger and do the detailing in the Makeup Tools. Adjust MFX, voice edits, whatever you need and then save.

Next step depends on if you want to take it further, or it’s done. If you want to add vocals, acoustic instruments, other keyboards/VSTi etc I used to record each Part as a stereo AUDIO Track (sync the DAW to MIDI clock and solo each Part while you record). This allows some quality compression, or better effects (I used to often record the Parts ‘dry’ so I could use better reverbs) and use the DAW’s automation to fine tune the mix.

Then a final 24bit audio export, and off to the mastering software…

There really are no shortcuts to a quality sound, it’s a slow laborious process no matter what you use. Roland haven’t exactly gone out of their way to make it easier, but that’s not the focus of an arranger. Try doing a live gig solo with a workstation! The work to set it up to do that is a nightmare compared to an arranger… 😱

You’re at the ‘running before you can walk’ stage right now, but it DOES get easier once you’ve figured out your workflow. 🎹😎

Hi.
I don't know if it's for any help at all, but here is a collection of instrument definisons for several brands / models I've found at the web long ime ago.
It's, according to the filename, copied from a Sonar installation.

I'll give it a try, thank you.