Hi ... I'm not sure if this is the best place to address this but I dont know a better catagory where to place ... so here goes ...

I'm looking to get a pair of powered speakers to use at larger venues and would like your experience and expertise as to which are the best quality to go for ... preferably 15" speakers to get a fuller sound and more bass and power, but at least 12" (or maybe there's not much difference ... please advise on this also:-)

JBL
EV (sxa100 ...i think they are 12" but supposed to be good quality)
Mackie
DB
RCF
DAS

or perhaps you have another make which are better ... I appreciate and am open to any ideas...

Thanks!
cyp,
UK

Hi!
Wish I could help but I don't like anything but Tannoy system 600A and may be System 800 self powered studio monitors.

I know that several guys over at General Arranger KB section here have more experience with live work than myself. Lately there have been a few discussions about speakers and quite a few models got mentioned.

I suggest you just ask them what they use for live gigs and I'm pretty sure you'll get some help. Over here there are a few people who know this stuff pretty well but unfortunately traffic is a bit slow so you might have to wait for a while.

-ED-

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A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone's feelings unintentionally.
- - - Oscar Wilde

Thanks Ed for your input ... I'll also ask there ...

cyp

So were talking full range PA speakers.
What are you going to put through them?
Vocals & backing tracks or full band?
If you are looking for a fuller sound with more bass, you may want to consider a system with seperate sub bass bins.
If you are a small outfit then your typical 'speakers on sticks' may be what to look for, and they are easy to transport around.
If you are part of a bigger band, then you may need something more 'stack like', but with these you are going to need a van to move them.

Your list highlights:

JBL (Junk but loud?) - I assume your thinking the Eon's here. Quite like them, althought the one I saw Thursday at a gig could have done with a new driver, a third of it was missing.

Electrovoice - recently had some demos of this stuff, great sound, highly efficient, but you have to pay for it, not cheap. Dynacord are a part of EV now too, if you have chance, check out the 'D-lite 2000' system - a 'powercube' with a 15" sub also powers the mid / top cabs, in fact it can power upto 4 mid / top speakers, and 2 additional bass cabs.

Mackie - I've been working with a band that has two sets of the MR450's plus the subs. Sound great, but these use RCF drivers, the new systems don't and as a result do sound quite as good appaerently.

DB - I've heard of them, but I've not herad any of their systems, so carn't really comment on them.

RCF - Had an RCF rig once, was stolen. Was a nice rig, plus they are a speaker supplier so they should know a thin or too.

DAS - I heard a DAS around 4/5 years ago. Looked like your typically Peavey set-up, but sounded so much better.

Others to consider:

HK audio - I've heard a LUCAS 2000, very nice, but I was told that HK have had some problems with them (high failure rate). Saying that, this Saturday I was working with a band (on lights) that had were using their new Projector system, seemed to be handling the task nicely. The DEACON system has simular power but less throw, but can be run with just the mid / top's in full range (great for a small venue where you may only need to have vocals), or you can run with mid / tops plus a set of bass bins, or run the whole lot mid / tops with all 4 bass bins.

Martin Audio - The band I normally work for has a 30 year old Martin system, and it's still doing the bussness (does need a overhall). Built to last! The 'Blackline' systems are good, but again pricey, but as the saying goes, you get what you pay for.

Nexo - If you have to ask, you carn't afford it. Small speakers, massive sound.

As you've probably found out, you are spoit for choice, and we've only mentioned a few brands. There's plenty of 'Happy shopper' systems out there too (back to you get what you pay for).
I suggest you get to demo, or better let as a shop isn't always the best envioment to crank things up in, try out a system before parting cash.

I was receintly looking at buying a rig (downsizing the old Martin), I was thinking HK, but the EV / Dynacord demo impressed me.
Powered speakers are great, no amp racks / crossovers to worry about, just plug in and go. Great, until something goes wrong as you carn't just borrow an amp to get you thorough for example. That was some thing I liked about the D-lite set-up, as the mid / tops, and add on bass bins are passive, if the 'powercube' goes, you can still run iwth what you've got if you can get hold of an amp or two.
As said to downsize the Martin rig I was looking to go HK's DEACON or Projector, nither system is cheap.
Dynacord do a system that would suit my needs, the Xa. The catch it's £9000, ouch!
Failing that, you go passive, and just have conventinal amplifiers and crossovers / system controllers.


As I didn't get home till 2.30 am I think I'll leave it there, I hope some of it helped.





(Dear Santa, I've been very good this year, and I would like.........)

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The Sonic Energy Authority - a sound investment

Thanks Sonic for going beyong the call of duty ... yes at 2:30 am you can make a special wish ...

how do you think these 'traditional' systems compare with the modern 'smaller' systems like Logitech Z5500 or similar ones ... I know that they are not as powerful, but they say their clarity is amazing...?

c'mom folks there must be more of you who are happy with your systems and can help advise ...

Thanks,
Izzy

A quick search on Google tells me these Logitech Z5500's are PC multimedia 5.1 speakers. Your not going to fill a venue with these, so I'm a bit confused.

What are you after?




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The Sonic Energy Authority - a sound investment

Hi Sonic,

I was wondering that just like you, but as I was advised at the beginning of this thread to put my question to the general arranger kb thread... over there this was one advice I received: "You have come to the right place. Like you, I have been one of those who thought that 15" speakers were necessary for full sound. What I learned here is that there has been a revolution in the way speakers do their job. The full sound I want can now be delivered by much smaller speakers.

Don't take my word for it. Use the search feature and look up the previous discussions of "Logitech" "Z-2200" "Z-5500" and "Bose PAS"

"

so ... now I suppose i'm even more confused as to which direction to take with setting up with a speaker system to suit lets say a wedding or largish event ... I prefer to wait and make the 'right' decision for me than to land up with a system I'm not 100% happy with ... know what I mean?

Thanks,
Izzy

We use (2) Yorkville LS800P
• Powered subwoofer• 1 X 18 inch woofer• Frequency response: 45 Hz - 150 Hz• 1.500 watts
• Max spl 134dB• Tilt back casters
• 143 lbs

See pic here: http://www.emionline.com/EMIrentals/speakers/poweredsubwoofers.html


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...shboom

[This message has been edited by shboom (edited 12-12-2005).]

CYP / Izzy;

I would still like to know what you want to put though the system your want to buy:
1)Is it just your keys?
2)Is it backing tracks, and vocals?
3)Is it a complete band?

shboom;
Do you run use you sub cabs with smaller (satelitte) speakers too?

That is affirmative.. I believe they are a 12 & a horn,(uncertain, they belong to our drummer)..they're mounted on poles that insert into the tops of the LS800P's, and they're heavier than my Grandmother's Christmas cake.

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...shboom

Hi Sonic ... it depends on what I'm asked ... that is I need to be flexible to accommodate different requests ... either a one-man band (keyboard) w/out vocals, sometimes with vocals, sometimes need to put through additional drummer & perhaps trumpet or clarinet ... get the idea?

Thanks
Izzy

Well, sounds like a job for a 'speakers-on-a-stick' along with at least one sub bass cab.

I'm thinking along the lines of the Mackie MR450's (or simular) which on there own sound fine - so would be ideal for a small minimal situation.
Then when required the sub cab used when you need more 'humph'.

Anything bigger might be a job for a local hire company to handle.

There's been disussion about the Bose PAS on one of the newsgroups I watch. Basically - best avoid! Anyone singing their prases may well work of Bose, or a music suppier trying to shift the things.
I'm not dismissing Bose, I started my with a an 802 system with the bass bins. Would be still an ideal system today (if you can afford it). The PAS personally doesn't cut the mustard.

Try before you buy...

thats the hard bit ... getting various different makes side by side, otherwise you cant really compare, right?

Also, you mention Mackie or similar, but it that range their are quite a number of choices (makes, size e.g. 12" or 15" for more bass etc.).

Thanks, You're right on now with what were lookiong for,
Izzy

Well if your local suppiler will not let you try out a system your interested in, perhaps you could 'hire' it from some else to see if it's up to the job.

I've been out twice this weekend.
First night I wasn't happy with the sound (speakers in the corners, behind the band. Not ideal!) I was beginning to think the rig was showing it's age.
Sounded fine last night.

As you've got keyboards to put though them, I think you are going to need at least 15" bass drivers to handle the lows keyboards's throw out. If it was just vocals, 12" would be fine.

I saw a ad on ebay reciently, "selling all our PA gear, as we are now using a Bose PAS", so it appears that these systems are avaiable in the UK. Still have my doubts about them, but I could be proved wrong.

Hi Sonic ... its not so much that the dealer wont let try them out but rather finding a dealer who has that large choice to choose from ... your idea of hiring them out is a good one even though lengthy, but hey I'm not in a massive rush ... prefer getting best quality - power and clarity - and not having to think about it again.

I think I'm going to do some research into those Bose Pas ...

Interesting you mention speakers behind band, thats a very important point to discuss ... as I am more comfortable to hear the exact same sound as the audience would be hearing, even though it can be difficult geting the right angle on them especially to avoid feedback from a mic ... but I know others believe they should be in front of stage and having to get extra monitor for self/band

... is there a right/wrong way?

thanx,
Izzy

I used to use a pair of EV SX500's and a Martin Audio Bass Bin, however for 1 person to lift all the time it used to crease me by the end of the night. I now use a pair of Mackie SRM450's (think that's the make as I'm not in front of them at the mo).
These are spot on and for vocals and keyboards they are crystal clear.
I also take the bass bin out for larger venues only.
Mackie, EV, Martin Audio all good stuff.

Izzy,

The normal aproach is to have the cabs slightly forward of the band, as you will get more gain before feedback into the vocal microphones. Monitors give the vocalist something to hear, and still feedback, but at least you can eq the sound to compromise without effecting the sound the people hear (which is the problem I had Friday).

These Bose(Bring Own Sound Equipment?)
I did notice that thier Web site features a band using them (all smiling of course because thier living in 'advertland'), but I don't see any mics on the drum kit.
scratch that, I can see a mic stand - bugger.
They offer a 45 day trial (I'm guessing you have to be in the US for this), but Bose UK has nothing about these systems.
I might be worth contacting them perhaps they might be getting them real soon.
BTW I would fit into the "too much gear" catergory.


[This message has been edited by TheSonicEnergyAuthority (edited 12-19-2005).]