exactly... on a piano you might tend to play the root position upper D most of the time depending on the harmony either side, because it most reflects the melodic line correctly.

In auto backing it is a stretch so you play the inversion because it's much easier and closer together and apc recognises either, and mostly you are highlighting the melodic line in the right hand at the same time anyway, whether in fingered or pianist mode.

Our apc chord finder built into the machines has "typical" positions highlighted for chords for this very reason, as well as the recognised inversions.

it was a good thread, thanks to Chuck's time, effort and inquisitive open mind...

Hi everybody,
What a great thread - thanks "lrngkybrd" for starting the whole thing. How the keyboard recognizes chords is something that one normally wouldn't know - thank you Alec for all of the explanations.
I am an old organ player and I normally would play 3 or 4 finger chords with the left hand and hold one note of that chord for counter melody while beating the rest of the notes for rhythm (along with the pedals). I would use chord inversions that were convenient and would keep all chords centered around middle C in order to keep left hand movement to a minumum. This of course generated many sustained chords without even thinking about it.
This technique which is common and works well on the organ does not work entirely well on the keyboard. An example is playing a C6 where the notes would be G A C E. This is recognized as Amin7 and of course the sound, the bass line, and the technichord harmony is entirely wrong.
This old habit, which is automatic when I play, is sure hard to break. It requires a lot of "jumping around" to always play the chord in the root position.
I wonder if anyone else has this problem?
Walt

Hi Alec,

Yep. Time to get the irons out and that is exactly what I did after my music lesson this morning. Played nine holes and hit the ball everywhere but where I was aiming (what's new?), but enjoyed the sun and the walk.

I feel as you do in that this has been a very interesting thread. Perhaps you will read my latest post on the other thread related to this topic and let me know your feelings regarding the initiation of other related topics (threads).

Thanks for the happy putting wishes. That was about the only part of my game that didn't backfire. Oh well. That's golf.

Take care.

Chuck

Good Evening Walt:

Yes, I use chords in the root position a lot for the reason you cite i.e., the auto bass line is incorrect when using some inversions in the APC mode. If I am playing organ on my KN6000, the pedals are providing the bass (obviously) and I have the auto bass turned off. Having that versatility (auto bass or pedal bass) is a real advantage I think. I have the option of playing either depending on what I feel is appropriate for the music I am playing. I would think it is indeed a hard habit to break when you want to play chords in the root position after playing them for years on an organ in their inverted form. I don't have that problem fortunately because I have learned to use root forms and inverted forms from the beginning. I often mix them while playing a tune as long as the sound suits me.

Take care.

Chuck

I agree, it sounds like Walt should maybe plug some pedals into his 7k, switch off apc, use the organ tabs with keyboard split and he could play just like he used to on the organ?

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You could step record all your chord changes first and thus make the left hand completely independent of the chord recognition - chord step record can be incredibly fast, literally preparing a whole song in seconds once you are used to it.

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However there is another solution that preserves 'live' playing and requires a little practice but not as much effort as re-learning all your chord positions, and that is to use the footswitch set to apc hold, particularly in pianist mode.

Here you can play what you like in the left hand without inappropriately changing the harmony, just releasing the pedal when wanting to change to the correct chord at the place that you want

Hello all,
I have a set of Roland MIDI bass pedals which I use for straight organ playing.
The setup works very well and with the combination of split keyboard, wonderful KN7000 organ voices, and occaisional use of Technichord, I have the best of two worlds.
I have since sold my Technics organ because it paled in comparison to the Kn7000. The only requirement is that you must have a good external speaker system to reproduce good organ pedal bass stops.
Alec - I hadn't thought about using the APC hold feature so I will try it, but I think the best long term solution is to learn to use the root position when using APC. I always play "live" so I guess I have to learn a few new tricks. Like I said, old habits are hard to break.
Thanks,
Walt

Hi All.
This thread has certainly started something and I think I'm going to have to print it all out to make it easier reading.
One of the chords which does need the use of the correct bass note is the Diminished Chord as the same four notes can be used for
four different keys but only sound right when used with the correct bass note.
This is where bass pedals add that extra dimension and I'm looking forward to the delivery of my new 17 note pedalboard.
Regards
Pete B

well, that is the total solution, because at the end of the day apc makes effectively a new instrument with different rules...

But thinking about it your 6th problem is probably one of the worst case scenarios, so learning root positions for these should help a great deal. I'd still try what pianist mode might offer though.

Hi
Interesting thread to but I can't understand the dilema of Scot Yee and maybe others to buy a keyboard to get the right chords in the display screen. For me not such a theoretical man is the choice for a keyboard can it play all the notes of the chord and for most people who listened to it do they like the harmony they hear and do not have in mind ay that's a Csus2 combination.

rgds.
Willem

Hi Willem,

I understand the point you are making and I think you are wrong to suggest Scott Yee opted for the Tyros because it displays chords in the form he prefers. Scott is an accomplished professional musician. Sound is what it is all about for Scott - not correct displays. His listeners cannot see his screen, only hear his renditions of music. It is SOUND that matters. Scott selected the Tyros because of its better jazz (altered)chord recognition capabilities in the APC mode when compard to the KN7000. At least that was my understanding when he was debating which keyboard would best suit his playing requirements.

Best Regards, Chuck