Does anyone know of a simple and cheap program that will "normalize" (same volume level for all songs) MP3's that I can use before I burn a CD or convert to the SD Card to play on the 7000?

Using Jukebox and converting MP3's to the SD Card, some recordings are loud, some are soft.

I have the same problem burning a CD using Roxio. To "normalize" using Roxio would be a costly upgrade.

It would be nice if I could make all MP3's the same volume level. Nothing worse then that sudden 'blast' when you're not ready for it.

Any ideas or help will be appreciated.

_______________
Thanks Larry Hawk

Hi Larry,

A compressor/limiter does wonders unless someone else has a better suggestion.

KN6 Guy

I find mp3 gain works fine, particularly since it is free: http://www.geocities.com/mp3gain/

Thanks...I downloaded the Beta MP3Gain It is a small download, simple to use, quick, and does a great job. Now all audio is the same volume level. Recommended !

One Item: MP3Gain has the option "Remove Tags". What are "Tags" in MP3'S and when, if ever should they be removed ?

Members of this forum always seems to have an answer. It's appreciated

Larry



[This message has been edited by lahawk (edited 05-22-2003).]

Larry,
On the same subject, Gold Wave does a good job and has the additional advantage that you can set thresholds for when the expander or compressor kicks in. I have used this to make CD's from various sources and of different levels and to reduce the dynamic range for use in the car. Commercial CD's, depending on the type of music, have tremendous dynamic range to the extent that if you set the radio volume control to a plesant level on the loud passages, the soft passages are not above the noise level in the vehicle. By reducing the dynamic range the music is listenable without blasting.
Adjusting the levels and the ranges are very desirable things to do depending on the application. Since this is done digitally, I find that if there is any noise or distortion added, I have never been able to hear it.
Walt

When I record a wave file into my computer, and then record it onto the SD card via the Panasonic USB reader/writer , the recording plays clearly on the KN7000. But-----the volume is well below that of my normal playing volume.
My question; Is there any way to record to the SD card at a higher volume.
Thanks, John C.

Thanks Walt,
I have heard good things about GoldWave for years. The reason I never purchaced it was that it seemed a little too technical. Is it ?
Instead I opted for a program call Acoustica Audio Mixer. This used in conjunction with Roxio Easy CD Creator burned reasonably good CD's. However I always had the loud/soft volume difference between songs. I believe MP3Gain will help solve that problem. If not, I'll shell out the $40 for GoldWave or similar software.

bruno,
The only suggestion I have is to record the original wave file at a higher volume. If ALL your recordings are playing at a low sound level on the 7000, maybe, just maybe, you might have to turn up the volume on the chrome console, as this is independent of the 7000 master volume...naaa that's too easy ...sort of like :
Question > Why is my Radio not working ?
Answer > Did you plug it in ?

SeeYa
Larry Hawk


[This message has been edited by lahawk (edited 05-22-2003).]

Goldwave is a fine entry level wave editor and can naturally do most of those things you would expect do with a wave editor, but you would have to process each mp3 individually, which takes a great deal of time.

Mp3gain can process the peak level of your entire mp3 collection automatically using a 'loudness' calculation to decide the shift required to make all songs seem the same subjective level.

In Alec's "Getting the Most from your 7000"
(still another shameless plug) he recommends burning CD'S using WAVE files rather then MP3, OR WMA files. I have recorded all three types to both a CD and the 7000 SD Card and can't really tell the difference.

What does make a difference, is the amount of KBPS Quality saved. On the software I use for recording, I have the option of saving anywhere between 15 KB (Mono) all the way up to 256 (Studio Quality)

Normally 192KB (CD Quality) is fine but 128 which is kind of the standard, is actually only Tape Quality.

So, in my opinion, if your going to burn a CD, it is probably more important to save the WAVE file at a higher quality kbps MP3 or WMA then to burn a CD or convert to SD with WAVE files. At least that is the results that are most pleasing to my ears.

Larry

[This message has been edited by lahawk (edited 05-23-2003).]

[This message has been edited by lahawk (edited 05-23-2003).]

absolutely, but any mp3 will forever lose information in the original wave file, so if you are going to make an audio cd use the wave before you delete it, because as I explain in the book you can always make a mp3 of whatever kb/s you choose afterwards from this cd, and since the wave is there before you can make the mp3 anyway, it doesn't make sense to make audio cds from mp3s if the wave is available.

The advice is to give you the best quality archive medium, because compression formats will evolve and get better in the future and you can then get better quality results from this full spectrum master recording made from waves rather than an already compressed original.

and thanks for the plug

Great Discussion,
Larry, you can download the free full featured GoldWave trial version, which can be used with no time limit. It is not as simple to use as MP3Gain but not too difficult. It has full batch processing capability so all of your desired files can be processed at once. I would suggest that you download it and try it. That's the purpose of shareware.
MP3Gain is also a great program and perhaps using both programs might be a usefull solution. "No pain,No gain", so try them all and see.
Just be sure to save your original files as Wave files and then make copies and experiment on the copies.
As Technicsplayer suggests, that unless your goal is to only make files that can be used in an MP3 player or for the internet, you should only use the wave file format because that is the native format for any audio CD.
Good Luck,
Walt


[This message has been edited by Walt Meyer (edited 05-23-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Walt Meyer (edited 05-23-2003).]

the main advantage of mp3gain apart from the saving in time compared to wave editors for Larry's solution is that the change is implemented digitally directly on the mp3 and is lossless, that is can be reversed with zero difference to the original, whereas a wave editor needs to convert the mp3 to wave and then convert back again to mp3 after normalisation, which involves a compression of a compression.

I'm not sure what you mean when you say " any mp3 will forever lose information in the original wave file" What information is lost forever?

I still don't "hear" any difference burning CD'S or converting to KN7000 SDCard no matter if it's a WAVE MP3 or WMA.

Walt I did not know that GoldWave was a no limit shareware. Maybe I'll give it a try. Thanks
Larry

well, high frequencies are curtailed on all but the very highest settings, and channels are mono-ed at high frequencies where stereo positioning information is lost on medium settings. Compression depends on masking, ie foreground sounds are encoded and background sounds are ignored. So mp3 compression is not like zip which can be restored to its original state, it throws away information which can never be restored.
The amount of compression threshold of differentiation will differ between people, source material and playback equipment like any other subjective judgement.
Making your audio cd from a mp3 of your wave recording does not restore the original wave quality, just effectively re-records your low bandwidth recording at a higher bandwidth again needed to make an audio cd. An analogy might be taking your 15 ips half inch 2 track Dolby A reel to reel recording, recording it on a good quality cassette with Dolby B, and then recording the cassette output on high speed reel to reel with Dolby A again.

Does anybody know of a program that will normalize WAV files so that they can be burned on a CD with all of them being at a relative even volume?

Thanks,

Larry

Larry,
GoldWave will do WAV files, MP3, plus 14 other types.
Walt

any wave editing program will normalise waves. Instead of recording into the Technics Audio recorder you just record direct into Goldwave and then increase the level to x % of peak. There are many other things you can do. Record 10 or 20 waves, make your cd, convert to mp3, then erase the waves to save space on the hard drive.

I see I forgot to answer the tags question. Artist, title, genre, album text can all be embedded in mp3s. There are 2 standards, if you buy a portable mp3 player they can display this text rather than the filenames. I have flash memory players that display ver1 ID3 and portable hard drive players that display ver 2 ID3. This information is what you see diplayed in winamp if written to mp3. Highlight a mp3 in winamp and do an Alt 3 to fill in the fields. There are many auto renaming programs that can rename lists of mp3s automatically.

Alec stated "Making your audio cd from an mp3 of your wave recording does not restore the original wave quality".....

therefore...

If information is lost forever once you convert from wave to mp3, can I assume there is no point in converting an mp3 back to a wave for recording ?

How about making copies from CD's recorded using wave files...will the copy be the same as the original wave ? Am I actually listening to wave files when I listen to a CD ?

I know I ask a lot of questions..

Thanks
Larry Hawk

yes and yes.
the only reason to make an audio cd of a mp3 is if you have no access to the original wave file or cd and want to play it on conventional audio cd players.