I didn't think that would matter much too you. This is your quote, "Hmm well I would occasionally require accustic sounds but my biggest passion is music such as Depeche Mode with Alan Wilder ."

Starkeeper

Hey can't a man change his mind ? lol

I also happen to be a fan of filmscore music . It's true that DM type music is my biggest passion but not the only thing I like . In other words I would not buy a synthesizer with good synths sounds but crappy accoustic sounds . I want something that can do well with both .

Anyway I kind of keep thinking that there must be a catch with this Alesis synth because for all that it offers it is so cheap . The Korg Oasys is way overpriced but I would expect a Workstation that can do all what these can to retail for close to $3000 or even more . Obviously not for $8000 like the Korg Oasys , that's just nuts .

The Fusion ,on paper,looks like a worldbeater.Certainly a better pricepoint than that overpriced "Oasys" thing...

Need to hear how it sounds though.

This is a current picture of my studio, just to erase the idea that my setup is theoretical. The newest component is the Novation X-Station on the front left. I don't know why an experienced opinion like mine gives you concern, but you are ignoring one glaringly obvious fact here: my newest synth isn't a Yamaha or related to the Motif in anyway. I spent the exact same amount of time comparing the X-Station to the Ion and to many other options as well (you haven't said if you've tried an X-Station so my guess is you haven't). The X-Station completely, without any compromise in sound or function, blows the Ion away. Not only is it a true VA with effects built-in but it is a full audio/midi interface with setups for controlling softsynths like Reason v3.0 which I happen to also favor a lot (again, no relation to Yamaha or the Motif). I spend a lot of time and money in music production and I buy the products that not only best suit my needs but represent a good value - the X-Station won that battle against the Ion for me, and if you participated in other forums as often as I do then you'd see that I'm not the only one who thinks so.

The options I added to my Motif added a few hundred, not thousands, to the price... more important to me is whether options exist for customizing the instrument to my personal needs AT ALL.

BTW: this thread started by asking for informed opinions, not personal attacks or for narrow-minded slams against someone's music (you criticize me spending less than an hour trying out an Ion then you form a quick opinion about my musical tastes/abilities based on the few samples I have on my website?). I've spent more than three and a half decades in professional music, so when I spend money on a product, it's usually after through review of ALL options. That gives me nothing less than the equal right to say what I think here when asked. You can criticize my opinions but you don't know my music and you haven't seen me play so don't go there.

Quote:

"But to be fair I wasn't crazy about the lack of a hands-on interface for the PLG150-AN and I shopped around for a new VA. I tried out the Alesis Ion, but for my money I liked the Novation X-Station 49 better and I bought one."

Starting to catch on when I say Yamaha doesn't have VA or real analog that competes with Alesis. Not a matter of being fair, just a matter of seeing things for what they are.

You didn't catch on that I said I didn't like the lack of a hands-on interface and nothing more. Have you tried an X-Station 49? Or are you strictly biased towards Alesis? I mean, c'mon... even you can tell from my studio that not only do I own Yamaha and Novation and I've already mentioned Reason but that I actually considered the Alesis Ion and found seomthing better for the money. That proves I have no bias towards or against any manufacturer. So far I see no evidence that you have anything except a bias towards Alesis.

Quote:

Im still under the assumption that what Yamaha offers doesn't hold a candle to efforts from Korg/Alesis/Nord and so on. Why dont you google me up some review links that say otherwise.

...just kinda hard for me to say "in light of its predecessors" given this is the first " workstation " Alesis has put out

Funny thing here...I only brought up Alesis SYNTHS ( not romplers ), to illustrate that we could have something around the same level of their VAs with a 32track sequencer ( if Im thinking right on the 32 ). The synth engine for the Fusion is ALSO all new much like the sample set thats gonna be droped in it. Just given its been common knowledge for years that Alesis VA kicks more or less everyone to the curb ( where relative )...its not hard to extrapolate the new synth engine linked to a sequencer its sample banks user samples and 24bit recording across eight tracks could be a very good thing.

I've owned and used Alesis products for many years and at one time I worked in a music store and sold them. I knew the factory reps... one day I asked them why they discontinued the popular Alesis Datadisk, which I relied on for my gigs at one time... they told me because it used a Sony disk drive that was no longer made - they decided rather than rewrite the operating system to accomodate other disk drives, they instead dropped the product.

I know you're again ready to blast me with "what does this or ANY of their previous products have to do with their wonderful VA's and their first workstation?" and I'll tell you: I've given several solid factual references to Alesis products that didn't measure up to their competition, didn't last in the market, or were dropped by the company rather than upgraded. Facts, not opinion. If the past performance, reputation and products of a company doesn't matter to you then you suffer from tunnel vision.

I stand by my original post on this thread. I use a Motif ES because it's one of the most powerful instruments on the market today. When I bought it nothing else could compare and it came from a company with extensive experience in building workstations. Today the Motif is a standard against which all other workstations will be judged whether you like it or not. Reviews of the Motif ES stand up against anything even remotely similar (please confirm this yourself before asking me to Google it for you).

The Alesis Ion is a good synth but I found one better. It happens. The Fusion may be great but it has equal potential to suck and I think everyone here has already said that. For all I know I may buy a Fusion someday myself... but only if it's the best value for the money compared to everything else and IF I believe that Alesis is the kind of company I want to rely on, again.

Go try an X-Station, just so you know what Alesis is already falling behind...

Pro,
Very nice set up you got there Wish mine looked like that.

Squeak

I'm by no means an expert but it seems to me the Alesis Fusion is underpriced for it's specs and the Korg Oasys overpriced . Anyone agree ?

Now no company is generous and gives products away cheaper for no reason so I'm just a tad suspicious on the Fusion .

I totally agree the Korg is FAR over priced, but I think the Fusion is sitting at par. Thinking the Fusion is 1700 or something, a couple hundred you can the X, it really brings it into the picture. Besides the HD of the fusion, id still rather have the Fantom by far! Im glad my e-mail helped some, if ya have any more questions let me know! Also, if you do end up with the Fantom and get the supreme dance, please let me know how it is, that is on my list Im really interested in the construction of this board, to me it looks like a toy, plasticy and very futuristic. It should be pretty cool. BTW Dark, you can easily hook a Fantom to your sound system. It has many L/R stereo 1/4ths and stuff, I cant imagine you couldnt.

Phil

lol some keyboards hooked to a pc...hahaha I just did a "dime a dozen" thingy with scores of setups much like that pictured in it. Sorry my experience goes a bit beyond that. Not to say you cant do great things within that environment ( or any environment for that matter ).

Beyond that Mr music production...what records are you on? What have you gotten broadcast? What band or bands do you play live with? what engineering credits do you have? What instruments outside of keys do you play? have you gotten your music production work on Broadway? Have you voted on the Grammy's? any of your work gain you four star reviews in rollingstone?

I read your bio and offer you respect for your accomplishments...I find the planetarium soundscape work you did to be a very cool thing and so on. Just please dont show me some keys hooked to a PC tell me about production work with some hint of attitude...when I already knew what your setup was :P more fodder for the next " dime a dozen " granted your setup is on the mid to high spectrum of home studios ive seen for what it is.

"The X-Station completely, without any compromise in sound or function, blows the Ion away. Not only is it a true VA with effects built-in but it is a full audio/midi interface with setups for controlling softsynths like Reason v3.0 which I happen to also favor a lot (again, no relation to Yamaha or the Motif)."

Yeah I noticed it has an insane amount of effects...lol just I feel the Ion sounds great without effects and beyond that would rather run through external effects then built in ( unless built in just kicks and sometimes they do ). As for midi and softsynths...I dont have any use for softsynths, for me regardless there is a disconnection I dont like when triggering anything off midi, I would rather play a separate instrument with better real time feel of its nuances ( hahah even if its a digital instrument ).

" I spend a lot of time and money in music production and I buy the products that not only best suit my needs but represent a good value "

Then why dont you extend that mindset to others that do the same?

"The options I added to my Motif added a few hundred, not thousands, to the price... more important to me is whether options exist for customizing the instrument to my personal needs AT ALL"

LOL yeah if you just leave the PC that your recording to out of the equation:P Sorry...but pc/soundcard/interface/programs are ALL part of the cost. Customizing a instrument to your taste becomes REAL simple...if you just play the parts and record them.

" you don't know my music and you haven't seen me play so don't go there."

NOTE what I said at first. Sorry I left of the line "not to insult your musicianship" cause guess what from your clips on your site...I can tell your a fine musician. I only wish to hear complete soundscapes and full songs done by you manually real time thats all. Beyond that I dont need to know your music to know I can do stuff at least on par with it. Hence the first set of questions I asked in this post.

"Or are you strictly biased towards Alesis? I mean, c'mon... even you can tell from my studio that not only do I own Yamaha and Novation and I've already mentioned Reason but that I actually considered the Alesis Ion and found seomthing better for the money. That proves I have no bias towards or against any manufacturer. So far I see no evidence that you have anything except a bias towards Alesis."

lol thats grand...I can put scores of companies gear that I use. As for being biased with Alesis...is there any way you can say the Ion is a BAD synth? Could you say the Ion is a BAD example of VA? All things are relative...to the extent of could you say a keyboard with a 32 track sequencer that perhaps sports the relative quality of VA as the Ion is a BAD idea? Hummm who seems biased here. I mean your the one that keeps digging unrelated examples from Alesis past ( when the company is under new ownership/magement now ) and cant even admit relativity speaking when they do something good in the present.

" know you're again ready to blast me with "what does this or ANY of their previous products have to do with their wonderful VA's and their first workstation?" and I'll tell you: I've given several solid factual references to Alesis products that didn't measure up to their competition, didn't last in the market, or were dropped by the company rather than upgraded. Facts, not opinion. If the past performance, reputation and products of a company doesn't matter to you then you suffer from tunnel vision."

Im not gonna blast you but ( when the company is under new ownership/magement now ) could mean something :P Outside of that...lol want to start listing off the failures of every other company, Alesis isnt the only one out there that has made stupid choices that caused those that supported them to suffer. Facts not opinions

" stand by my original post on this thread. I use a Motif ES because it's one of the most powerful instruments on the market today. When I bought it nothing else could compare and it came from a company with extensive experience in building workstations. Today the Motif is a standard against which all other workstations will be judged whether you like it or not. Reviews of the Motif ES stand up against anything even remotely similar "

LOL the one that talks about bias...the one that talks about " getting the gear that works for you " is telling me about the most powerful instrument on the market today. Seems you might be a bit biased ( or just hypocritical )...sorry man hate to break it to you but offerings from Korg and Roland are just as much an industry standard as the Motif.

"The Alesis Ion is a good synth but I found one better. It happens. The Fusion may be great but it has equal potential to suck and I think everyone here has already said that."

I think the key here is you found one better for YOU...past that I agree with the last part here. Sorry just I fail to see how midi control and a bunch of effects relate to analog synth emulation:P


"Go try an X-Station, just so you know what Alesis is already falling behind..."

Lets see...I dont use loops, I dont use any sequencers, I dont use midi very often, I dont use soft synths, Ive got a wealth of external digital and analog effects, I do most recording open air through random amps...That about kills off all the advantages you stated the X-Station offers for me.

Unless I wish to go for a unit with less program banks, less setup banks, give up the pitch bend mod wheels for a joystick/ribbon controller, less knobs many that are just low rez encoders, give up the extensive patch options of the mod matrix, give up tons of filter types, toss drift out the window, then pay 50$ more then what I got years ago :P

All ive got to say, spin it however you want cause you will anyway.

To me, it seems that the “low price” of the Fusion is not that it is of inferior quality, but a business decision for marketing purposes. I would think that they would want to penetrate the market.

As the discussion in this thread has shown, regardless of which side you take, Alesis does not have a part in the synth/workstation market like Korg, Yamaha and Roland. So in order to get to where the big three are, they have to offer a superior product and at a very competitive price. To me, that is what they are doing with the Fusion. I wish some arranger manufacturers would take a leaf out of that book. Contrast that with Roland coming out with a keyboard like the Fusion, they could easily start at 2500 for that keyboard because they have a large part of the synth/workstation market to play with.

To the other extreme, Korg with their new board has taken their market power in the work/station market too far. That thing is just too over priced and they may not get a good return on it. Even if you have market power, you just have to know when to stop.

Alone & Foresaken:

I am ending our discussion. You still insist on turning a synth discussion into a personal attack, which is immature of you and a waste of my time. It's especially cowardly to be disrepectful of my music and career without providing me with the same opportunity to see who you are and read your bio, your recording credits, etc. Since you have no website or bio listed with your identity then it's only logical to assume you have none of the credits that you are asking of me and you are not to be taken seriously. Come back when you remedy that and can manage to discuss synths and arrangers without resorting to childish insults and we'll talk further.