It's time to open my store (10AM) and UPS just arrived. Genesys is here! I'm going to open it up and start playing. I will report back later!
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California
818-881-5566

Come on george can't wait to hear your opinion.Did they just send you 1 keyboard?
I am still waiting for mine to arrive.

After a day with Genesys, I am finally at home and have had some times to collect my thoughts. Because of all the features on Genesys, I didn't want to sit at my computer during the day and start rambling on with each new feature I discovered.
Let me start by saying a big "thank you" to Chris Anthony. Without his help, and the well written owners manual, I would never have discovered so much information about the Genesys keyboard.
First, when Genesys arrived in a huge carton via UPS i knew this was a heavy keyboard. However, looking at it, you would expect it to be quite as heavy because it really is not a very large package. Of course the straight up speakers are why the extra weight, but they are very attractive and sound great. I did note that when playing styles and sounds, the volume was not quite as loud as when playing .wav and MP3 files. I don't know why this is, but I will do a lot more investigating over the next few days.
One of the first things I noticed when taking the keyboard out of the box, was the thoughtfully documented buttons along with a quick description of key features written right on top of the keyboard. Thanks to Chris Anthony for this thoughtful addition. It makes it easy on the salesfloor to remember key features when doing a demo with a customer.
The operating system on this keyboard is much more user friendly than previous WK products. It is extremely easy to navigate both all the functions and more importanatly, easy to navigate around loading and saving on the different drives available. I was thrilled to see this.
First thing I did was play many of the sounds. At first, I was actually disappointed because I was not finding or hearing the sounds as were demonstrated to me in Italy and by Chris at NAMM. A phone call to Chris was all it took! There is a voice family called "real sounds" which for some reason I missed. I was playing sounds in the catagories with names like Piano, Brass, Guitar, Organ, Strings, Winds, etc. but I missed this different colored button my first time through. There are 16 "real sounds" which were what were played for me in Italy. these sounds are outstanding. The real piano is taken from the sampled faziola piano which generalmusic has been using in the PRO MEGA 3 Piano and the two saxes (real alto and real tenor), the real trumpet and real trombone are sure to impress you. The real violin and real cello were very real sounding as solo instruments. There was a really good real harpsichord a great real flute with all that special flute stuff we've come to love with Yamaha's "sweet flute". All the other sounds reminded me of many of the sounds in the WK8, but when I asked Chris about these sounds, he let me know that these have mostly been newly sampled for the Genesys. Honestly, I spent most of my time today, using some of the new features and checking out some of the compatability issues some of my customers have been asking me about, so tomorrow I will have time to check out the other 1000 or so voices. Again, Generalmusic wanted to make this keyboard easier to use then any of their previous models and i really think they've done a good job here.
The feel of the keyboard is really good. They have used weighted keys (synth type) like the Ketron X1 and it felt just right with really good aftertouch feel. When changing voices, the buttons to both sides of the display at first seemed a bit small, but as I played them, they got easier and easier to get used to. Having 8 choices on each side of the screen means either having a larger screen or smaller buttons and Generalmusic opted for smaller buttons. The screen is not a color one, but everything was quite clear to see.
Next I tried several of the styles. I was really glad to find a function within the system button section which allowed me to turn off the last selected option. When the keyboard is shipped it is "on" and so whenever I chose a new style catagory, just by changing to a new catagory, the first (or last) style selected began playing. I hated this, because it never gave me a chance to pick the style I wanted to play and chose one for me. By turning off this function, I could scroll around any catagory and not until I chose a new style would that style start playing. There are 256 factory preset styles, each with four variations, intro's endings and fills. There were so many good styles to try. Big Bands, Latin with real RASS grooves, Country, which included 2 great unplugged guitar strum styles, Rock, with great distorted guitars and great drums, gospel, Mexican (programmed by Chris Anthony) which were all so authentic to Latino music traditions. I could comment all day about the styles, but there is much more to say tonight. Some styles reminded me much of former WK products and yet there were so many great new styles. Lots of Jazzy Brush work and great big bands. I especially liked a sound called Brass 3 which included a great shake on the trumpet when you played with harder Velocity. When you played normally you would hear a great Sforzondo build up over time, but when you played with more velocity, the entire brass section, including Trumpets, Trombones and Saxes would be there and when played harder here came the lead trumpet player with a great jazz shake sound.
I just didn't have enough time to really play through more than maybe 40 of the 256 styles today.
The next thing I did was to test the Vocal Genius controls. It worked great. It worked like the vocal harmonizer in the WK6 and WK8 but with the addition of a dedicated lead voice volume and a dedicated vocal harmony volume. You can balance these out or use only one or the other. The effects are easy to add to your voice and there is an on and off button to turn the mic on and off. I tried it with the single fingered and fingered modes as well as in vocoder mode and it worked perfectly with all types of fingerings. A microphone is included with the keyboard, but I would like to try some other mics out as well. It is a high impedence connection. There is both a mic and line input on the back and a seperate gain control for both.
Next came listening to the supplied songs on one of the two supplied CDs. CD 1 is the operating system and simple demo backed up because these are already on the hard drive and CD2 contains a few hundred different format songs. there are SMF songs, GEM songs, MP3 songs. The GEM songs are basically tune 1000 songs which have been tweeked for Generalmusic use. You can have 32 tracks so you can add more if you want and each song has a vocal harmony track and lyrics ready to play. When you select one of these songs everything sets up automatically for you. We took our own CD of John Lennon's Imagine, and transfered it from CD track to .wav song. It was really cool and easy how you "grab" the track and it converts it for you. You can even type in lyrics and have lyrics on your MP3s. Next, we tried out the vocal cancel function which worked pretty good. Generalmusic explains that if the vocal is right in the center of the stereo image without a lot of heavy reverb proccessing, you have a good chance to remove almost all of the vocal tracks. Some songs will do a better job at this then others. Once the vocal track has been removed, you can sing and record your own voice or instrument in place. This is nothing new in Kareoke but it is new on a keyboard. There is also wav editing available so you can go in and snip off or copy and paste things you might like to play with.
My next adventure was to find out if we could install the WK8 oriental kit into Genesys. I was told yes in Italy but I had to try it for myself. It worked great and after loading the two disks, I save it on the hard drive. I was informed by Chris that he was currently working on a project to make Persian/Iranian styles for the WK series of Generalmusic keyboards and these will also work on the Genesys. There is also a team of musicians from Lebenon currently working on a oriental kit for Genesys. So for all my middle eastern customers out there, I don't think you will be disapointed.
Now, to some this all up.........I know many will want to know my thoughts about comparing this GENESYS with the TYROS I saw a few weeks ago. These are clearly in my mind, two winners. However, they have different strengths. Tyros sounded awsome, and had some of the best sounds and styles I've ever heard, but is there a CD......no! can you load new samples in.........no! Can it play MP3 or Record direct to CDR?.........no. Can you reload the entire 64 Mb worth of memory up with completely new information......no!
Does Genesys have a beautiful color screen......no! Does Genesys have 128 notes of polyphony?.........no! Will the Genesys weigh 25 lbs?.........no! These are two top of the line keyboards and both deserve your serious consideration. Look at your needs and decide which will be best for you. And, don't forget the Ketron SD1, Korg PA80, Ketron XD9 and Vega, Yamaha 9000 pro, Korg PA60, Roland VA76, and yes, even though you've all heard of the years why I won't carry this brand, the Technics KN7000. All of these are great keyboards and you are fortunate to have so many wonderful choices.
If you have any specific questions I can answer please let me know.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California
818-881-5566

Thanks again George for this (another) great review already.
The only disadvantage is that now you will have to report much more about this new baby...
ReneT

thanks George

Hi. Thanks George for the time you spent writing and discovering Genesys.

I would like to ask of you what you've heard. And that is your pure opinion.

1.Do you think that the single sounds, sound are as good as Yamaha or say the new SD1?

2.is there only 16 of these REAL SOUNDS? and are these the same thing as we had in REAL PERFORMANCE of WK4&8?

3.I don't know if you heard the demo of the SD1 a cappela VOICES, if you did is there any voices like that in Gen?

4. The Vocal Genius, does it sound real? I mean not a robotic thing.

5. The main thing about a keyboard is the SOUNDS, you think there has been a great improvement from the WK8? I am not talking about the 16 real sounds but the overall sounds+DRUMS.

6.I know it's a matter of taste but if you where to pic three of your best keyboards would Genesys be one of them??

Once again thx Geaorge and please keep us informed about it cause it is still very Skerce to find.

Tony.

Tony,
When I go into my store this morning, I will spend time with playing sounds and report back to you.
The 16 real voices are all brand new sounds with special attention given to a very realistic sound. Using effects and aftertouch and dynamics to make these sounds sound more realistic.
After playing the 16, I found myself looking for more pages with another set of 16, but it looks like there are only 16 preset real voices.
More later!
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

Thanks very much for the report! How many people out there can have the opportunity like you - to be able to making a living by playing all days!

ps. You have any job opening in your store?

Me, me! I make a living playing all NIGHT.
Don

George,

Thank you very much for the review. Unfortunately, it seems to me that I really need to try this keyboard first. I was wondering if there are any ballad styles and how good did they sound?


BUT.... I am wondering what would Uncle Dave think of the sounds and styles of this new keyboard. Basically, as the most critical member in this forum of GEM keyboards, if he liked the sounds and styles of genesys, that would be an extremely positive testimony to it.

I wonder if you George can find out a little bit more on Genesys for drum kits and sounds for techo/dance type of music. Maybe GEM will surprise people like me this time. George, whenever you get a chance.

[This message has been edited by New Yorker (edited 08-23-2002).]

Ok,guys and girls,,,,
I just spent 3 hours with the sounds and I am happy to say, this keyboard has hundreds of brand new sounds that are great.
At first, going through single sounds, I was finding pages of exactly the same sounds found in the WK series. However, as I soon found out, the 300 or so new sounds are found in higher pages, like page 7 or 8 or 9. The reason for this was to keep all compatability for WK users who are coming up to Genesys without loosing anything or getting wierd sound choices in song and styles from the WK products. Brilliant, a company thinking about past customers and not reinventing the wheel!.
I found a great mellow piano not used in the piano preset family, and have now saved in in the piano user family. By the way, the memory system of this keyboard is really easy to use. You have 128 banks of 8 registration memories which memorize everything(thats 1024 registration memories on board), you have 16 locations for each sound family catagory to put you favorite edited sounds by family, and you have 8 style preset for each style you choose(one touch settings). And the best part is when you push the store button, you choose which one of these three areas you want to store something, so it is quite easy to do.
The choir voices are great with newly sampled gospel type voices and great male and female. PLEASE REMEMBER when trying out this keyboard in a store that the voice presets are outstanding but that there are so many other single voices which are new that you will want to try out as well and don't forget that they are in the higher page numbers...
All the great latino samples which have been used in the WK6latino keyboard are here and I am amazed at the ability to use real vibrato on many of the REAL VOICES doesn't change speeds when played in different octaves. This was acheived in more advanced sampling conditions which Chris Anthony has explained to me. This has always been a problem in most sounds that use a lot of vibrato in Solo Voices, but Generalmusic has done a marvelous job of fixing this problem with newer sampling techniques.
I am now going to play with the styles this afternoon and will report back later. I can tell you that the Unplugged 1 style is something I've not heard from anyone yet. There are two unplugged styles. 1 is guitar strumming and 2 is fingerpicking. 1 is perfect for a Beatles Song like "Hey, You've Got To Hide Your Love Away". It works perfectly for many tunes needing just a strummed guitar.
More to follow.....Thanks for your Patience!
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

I almost forgot to tell you about the drum samples.........
they are great. Especially the new kits called live 1, live 2 and ambient. When you hit the snare light on say live 2 you almost don't hear any stick at all (it's almost like you are using brushes to strike the head) and as you increase velocity not only does the stick become noticable, but also the samples crossfade and the effects change. Beautifully done! and the open high hat stays open for a really long time and decays exactly like a real cymbals.
Something else I forgot to tell you about in the previous post is that by going through all the family of sounds presets, you pretty much are hearing a best of all the new sounds and I've been told that there will be a generalmidi mapping available which will use all the best of the new sounds in a generalmidi mapping.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

Thanks George for your on going review of this keyboard.
I'm ordering one in the UK this coming week and your comments have confirmed quite a few things I wanted to know. It obviously has loads of great sounds and styles in it, but for me the main reason for buying one was for the onboard cdrw and mp3 playback. I'm pleased to see you say it's easy to navigate (unlike some I could mention), that will come in handy when I'm out playing (I do sing a long nights in local clubs, semi professionally for the time being and also do backing tracks for other artistes). Well, can't wait to get my own to go along with my SD1 and G1000, thanks. I'll try to post some MP3's when I'vd made them somewhere.

Ok,
The styles are sensational! Dance and Techno are all great. None of the styles in this Genesys are just remaps of old WK styles. Fresh and Unique. The Dance and Techno use lots of really synthy sounds. Also, every style now has different intro's when playing minor chords which are completely different then when you play major chords. The guitar tracks are great within the country and rock catagories and remember, with 32 styles in each catagory they covered their basses really well in every catagory.
All the styles are excellent with great differences in the 4 variations.
Here's my initial impression of the Genesys...
To look at the interface you think WK 6 or WK8 on the screen. But to listen to the sounds and listen to the styles, you know this is a new keyboard with great sounds, styles and of course, new features such as MP3, Wav and CD player recorder.
I just realized a great feature. For those needing a great backup band and you use different modules and keyboards for different sounds you love, you could record a midifile using all your modules in your studio, then save them as an MP3 and you would be able to play these in the Genesys. And your lyrics would still be shown on the screen or on a video monitor.
George kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

This keyboard gets better by the minute.
I'd thought of the midifile you mentioned below although i don't use them much. The backing I produce is done in Cubase/Reason or Pro Tools. I can save the audio as MP3, stick it on a CD, shove it into the Genesys and play live over the top (or transfer MP3 to hard drive)great! I could even record styles from my other keyboards and leave them at home and I can also record my guitar playing into it, yippeeeeeee.
Are the sounds and styles at least on par with the SD1?

I just put a few of my older and newer midi files into the Genesys and I loved the results. The newer files are all choosing GMlevel2 sounds which like XG offer better sound quality and my older midi files are choosing the better panel voices which generalmusic mapped from GM to choose these sounds. This is much more like the Ketron products which use their better voices instead of gm voices.
It's now time to go home and I'm loving this Genesys the more I'm playing it. I have discovered that some of the styles are from the WK8 such as Gipsy but with the new sounds the drums and guitars are so much improved.
Oh, by the way, another new keyboard arrived today from Yamaha. It is the DGX300. 76 piano style keys with light weight, disk drive, and new piano sample called "live!grand", beautiful styling and a selling price of $449.00. With all my excitement over Genesys, I've almost not looked at this Yamaha. I am very impressed with this and anyone looking for an entry level keyboard with a more piano feel with all the arranger functions of the PSR350 will surly like this one.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

George,

Have you found any decent ballad styles on genesys?

How would you compare PSR9KPRO with genesys, in sounds and styles?

Sorry for the many questions but we are reading with extreme interest.

Thanks.

George, since you are the only GEM dealer active on the forum, I think everybody would appreciate it if you would post a general idea of price. Maybe MSRP and/or MAP.
Thanks,
Don

Retail price in UK is £2700, you can get one between £2100-£2300 cash, after shopping about. No idea of USA prices or Euros.

Here in the US, Generalmusic does not suggest a retail price to dealers. At Kaye's Music Scene the Suggested Retail Price is $4500.00. As we have been asked not to quote prices by Nigel, the synthzone moderator, selling prices are not quoted on this forum. This price is a guide only. All dealers may set their own retail and selling prices.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California
818-881-5566

I came into my store today to play around with the Genesys. I called up a SMF of the Everly Brothers All I Want To Do Is Dream, Dream, Dream. I turned on the Vocal Genus which already had the vocal channel for the midifile selected, hit record and selected "New Stereo Wave", pressed start and recorded my first wave file along with all the midifile tracks. When done, I pressed stop, a screen came on which asked me to name my .wave file and which folder did I want to save it in. When finished, I found the file pushed play and it sounded.......terrible because I'm a lousy singer, but the recording sounded great. I then made a CD of my song when finished right inside the Genesys. This is a feature none of the others can do. I can really see alot of customers loving this feature.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California.

George keep us informed but you haven't answeard my question and that is. If you where to pic 3 best keyboards will Genesys be one of them that is considering and most important the sounds styles and overall SOUND. Appreciate if you would answear.
And one other thing how would you compare the styles to the SD1.

Thx TONY

[This message has been edited by ziggy (edited 08-25-2002).]

In terms of sounds and styles I cannot place an order of 1,2,3. I can however tell you my favorites of whats available on the market today. I am not going to include TYROS until it is in my store and I can play all the styles and sounds like i've done all the other ones. My opinion from just hearing it for a short time a few weeks ago is that it will be right among the top models on my favorite lists.
Ketron XD9/Vega and SD1 are on my favorite list (not the X1 because of it's piano sound and older numeric system for calling up styles and sounds)
Generalmusic Genesys (It does everything well so far!. Some might not be happy with weight, a carry over of WK8 sounds and some styles, but with enough new sounds and styles to surely satisfy most players)
Korg PA80/60(A very well rounded keyboard although I would say in the style and sound dept. just a notch below the other ones mentioned)
These all have outstanding sounds and styles. The Piano is stronger on Genesys and Ketron then the PA80, but I still like all the sounds on the korg.
In the next group would be the Yamaha 9000pro, the Roland VA76, the YamahaPSR2000.(Piano sounds better on the 9000 and VA76 than the PSR2000, but the 2000 has to be up there for styles and sounds although much less expensive than the rest. The Yamaha 9000 and VA76 have what I would call older type styles that are a little more bland and less exciting than the top choices and even the PSR2000, but many customers still choose these because they like more neutral styles).
I would put the Generalmusic WK6/WK8 just behind this group(sounds not as strong but still great styles)
The hard part of trying to group these keyboards is because in some areas, even some of the second tier models are as strong if not stronger than the first, but if you are asking me my opinion as to which ones my ears like to hear the best and which ones get my customers the most excited, I will stay with my choices.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

Hello George,

As always, great reviews. And I'm really diggin' the way you keep coming back with more stuff. Funny how I find myself coming back to this site at least once every two hours (what did he find now?).

Got kind of a different question for ya...Hopefully it's not too out-of-whack.

Have you tried to save some of the new sounds (or styles or songs) from Genesys to a floppy and load them into a WK8 (just out of curiosity if nothing else)?

I guess my question comes from you saying that it appears they are using the same processor as the WK8 rather than newer technology (which is fine IMHO). And, I realize that the same processor doesn't necessarily mean the same tone generators (or maybe it does?). I guess you trying it would kind of answer that question. If it doesn't work, or if it does but the sounds are terrible, then it looks like some tweaking was done to the tone generators.(?)

If ya get a chance....

Thanks.

mike

What did you mean by TERREBLE SOUNDS?????

Hmm, good question.

Okay, when we save a sound file from a keyboard to a floppy, what do we end up with on the floppy? The actual sound...Of course not. We end up with software that manipulates, triggers, and/or setups the proper parameters of the tone generating hardware in the keyboard. Pressing a middle 'C' on the keyboard simply says, okay hardware, you've been told how to sound, now give me a 'C' using that sound.

Now here is where my assumption comes in (and I could be totally off base here), I assume that the hardware comes first. The ability to make the sound has to be there first, right. The software sets up the hardware to generate the sound. And if that is true, and Genny uses the same hardware as WK8, was the ability to generate the sound always there from the beginning, were we simply waiting for them to develop better software? Or are the two always developed together, side by side?...Can't have one without the other.(?)

So back to my question about might work but sounds crappy. The Genny sound file loads successfully into the WK8, the new register displays correctly, Live Sax, for instance. But when you start pressing keys, sound emits (tone is being generated) but it's not the same, it's distorted or it has some weird effects added or maybe it just doesn't play at all. The software has given commands to the hardware, the hardware is trying to follow, but it just can't. It doesn't complain (because it wasn't programmed to), it simply can't generate the sound like it should.

That tells me that they have tweaked the hardware and I think that is a good thing. I would expect that from a new generation keyboard. I wouldn't expect the the new sounds of Genny to be reproduced by the WK8...but I just had to ask.

Kind of 'whacked', isn't it?

mike

[This message has been edited by msutliff (edited 08-26-2002).]

[This message has been edited by msutliff (edited 08-26-2002).]

Apart from the demo's of the Genesys on General Musics site, are there any other MP3's available that anyone has seen elsewhere?
I've got about a 2 week wait for my Genesys to be delivered and I'd like to here more sounds/styles in the mean time.

OK got you now.
Now about waiting 2 WEEKS, I have put a deposite about 6 weeks ago but haven't got it yet!!!!