Clif,

It says that they have added two buttons - give me a break! The 'Va' in Italian (and Spanish) means 'Go' in English - remember the proverbial marketing fiasco of marketing Chevy Nova in Puerto Rico, when GM marketing honchos did not realize that nobody wanted to buy a car called No-Go?

On the subject of Oriental sounds - the soundset of VA series is a superset of that in G1000/G800/E70; hence, any sound that you could find in G800 you will also find in VA instruments - you are right, George.

As far as sound expansion goes, for my usage (live performing and home use) it is not detrimental, though, as Clif is saying, if I had the option, I may be tempted to splurge on some sound expansion cards. The instrument of my dreams would be a 76-key instrument in a compact case (like Solton), with inobtrusive built-in speakers (like Roland KF90), vocal harmonizer, hard disk (don't give me the unreliable ZIP drive), and the user interface which is both easy to use and efficient (for live performances), besides the high quality sounds and styles. The VA series seems to come up short in most of these categories, so I doubt that I will upgrade.

Regards

The KN6500 is, indeed, expandable to 80 MB Cliff!.(48+16+16=80) By the Way, are you REALLY still a Junior Member?

Well, I think Roland have done what a few keyboard manufactures have done this past month or so, and that is a "Minor" upgrade from it's orininal Flagship EG :kn6000/6500, Psr/9000/9000 Pro etc. And now VA-7-VA76. As for new buttons, there are , it seems, 11 new buttons on it if you look at the far right of the keyboard

These two top arrangers are excellent keyboards anyway, and just a few MB of Rom (48MB) will, it seems keep the comsumer happy...for a while at least. I will keep my Kn6000 - and wait a while till a new "redesigned" model comes out - and that might be something! as long as Technics put Sound/rhythm's etc as priority - before putting a "Laptop size screen on it! (the one we have now is far big enough)...

You can always get a future keyboard today - in the German made ABACUS from WERSI, if you have about £5,000 + to spare that is (with it's extras).

Roland just haven't got it Yet, and will take some time before they are even on a par with the above mentioned top line arrangers in my opinion of course. The VA-7 is good up to a point, but today's demanding musicians...demand more!

Tony, England, UK



[This message has been edited by Jupiter5 (edited 03-07-2001).]

Clif, Alex, and all,

Roland and Solton aren't the only ones that blow it big time when it comes to marketing. Few people remember that Chevrolet marketed a cheap little car in the 70's called the Chevette (which means "sweat" in French).

I'm still happy with my 9000PRO . . . play it most everyday. The one thing it's missing is a midi to sty file conversion program. I know I could buy one from Fran but doesn't it seem that for the BIG money we're paying for these keyboards that they could include such a useful utility? Oh well, guess I go and play myself a sad song . . .

Steve

The E-40's total Arabic sounds are 22 oriental sounds and 1 oriental drum set. the E-500OR's total sounds are 38 sounds and 3 drums set. the E-500OR have all the Arabic sounds from the E-40 but to tell you the truth I never use them, I use only the new sounds that are in the E-500OR which is the new 16 sounds and the new 3 drums set(16 out of 38 sounds).the VA-76 got the E40 modified which was created when the E-500OR was released. it is basically have new samples and you will know that if you played the one on the G-1000 to the VA-7.the E-500OR 's market was lost because it had many errors in it's operating system and it was too expensive for many people.so they got it out and had now the EM-50OR. my problem in here is that Roland always puts any OR system or sounds and drums ( the new sampled ones) in not good keyboards. and I think you know what I mean.(the E-500 and the EM-50).look at solton, they putted their new Arabic sounds on the X1 which is good in functions but for sounds I'm kinda used on Roland's sounds and Korg's too that's why I 've been waiting for Roland .Korg also puts it's oriental sounds in their latest arranger keyboards like the I-30/PA-80(the pa-80 have actually new Arabic sampled sounds and drums too).but when it comes to Roland they get cheap...you know, many people was happy when they putted what the E-40 had in the Em-2000,G-600/800/1000 because we can use the latest keyboards and we have our Arabic sounds.but the E-40's sounds is not actually that good and what they did in the E-500OR was a big improvement, increasing like 80% good in sounds quality more than the E-40 .

so many people just like me wants to use this new sounds in a more professional Keyboard. that actually have more polyphonic, because the sounds seems using allot of polyphonic(that is a big issue in the Em-50OR).and it have their latest sounds and functions too (I don't care about the styles! they can always be loaded as long as the keyboard have the sounds).

that's why I am not happy at Roland and what they done because if they gonna do it .it's gonna be in the NEXT 76/61 key arranger keyboards which is after 6 years or more!. am I right or wrong in here? and I can't wait 6 years for one so I will just go for the soltonX1 or the PA-80 .


------------------
vic

I used to be a senior member with 400+ messages, but I am getting younger since the crash! I did remember the Nova disaster, but the Chevette was new to me.

Alex, our opinions on the VA-76 are pretty similar. I think Roland has great sounds, I just wish they could package them better in the arranger context.

Stevizard. I concur that the 9000Pro is a great arranger. It really has everything in one elegant package. I still and not real fond of Yamaha sounds and styles. I was seriously thinking about getting one anyway; the the Solton SD1 a possible second choice. I just bought the Karma--which lacks many of the features that I want, but provides the real-time control that I (and I think you) had been longing for. It is a pretty deep programming environment; by the time I master it, the 9000Pros successor will be out and I may get it. George Kaye is suggesting it will be a big improvement, at least insofar as styles go. If I were gigging I would prefer a dedicated arranger, but for exploring new territory the Karma is great. The Karma would work well with a 9000Pro, driving the Karma with the 9000Pro keyboard and coupling the Karma audio outs to the 9000Pro audio ins. But there is a lot to be said for having everything in one keyboard and mastering that keyboard.

However, given that people want an integrated keyboard, and that arranger players often like to sing, it sure seems that Roland is missing the boat by omitting (realtime) vocal harmony.

Steve,

on the subject of style conversions - you should consider yourself fortunate that you can buy a style conversion program from Fran. I understand that Technics had asked that EMC not provide support for their new KN6000 (and 6500) series.

Tony, I stand corrected - indeed there are more than 2 new buttons - on closer look I can see 8, due to my less than perfect eyesight. Which is more of the reason to want a usable (and efficient) operating system. With regards to Wersi - part of the requirement is reliability and quick turn-on, so I am not sure that Windows 98 would qualify. Besides, I am not sure if they have ANY dealers here in the US, who can demonstrate this instrument.

As far as our wishes for the perfect keyboard - I know as well as anybody that it is unreasonable for us to expect a major manufacturer to package all of the top of the line features in a single instrument; however, the tone of my comments is affected by the disappointment nonetheless.

Regards

Clif,

A Karma and a 9000PRO linked together just might be the ultimate keyboard. If I had as much money as Uncle Dave (just kidding Dave, don't send a hit man), I might attempt it. Let's see, I'll tell the wife that the Karma is really an automobile engine diagnostics tool and will save us a lot of money (can't tell her I need another keyboard).

Alex,

You're right. Having any conversion program is better than none at all. I guess I'm too used to buying software for computers which is generally less expensive and has a short life-span. Software obsoletes so quickly that spending $350 for any kind of software seems too much. Hey Fran, send me a copy of EMC Styleworks Universal, and if I can't crack the code, I'll buy it. (ha, ha)

All Arrangereers,
OK now, that was a joke, so don't send me anything about the evils of hacking (or you'll find your computer sizzling into a hunk of plastic that's stuck to your desktop).

The bottom line is this: It's not the name on the back of your keyboard or the number of new gadgets that's in it that counts, it's the music you hear inside yourself and your musical ability that count. Great music is created by great musicians. Still, I'm standing in the wings with all the arrangereers and am waiting to see what the next "ultimate" keyboard will be.

Toward that end, it seems like Yamaha is gearing up for the next BIG jump. They've found a way to add over 220 notes of polyphony to a single keyboard. That's a lot of notes . . . I think they intend to put them to good use. The incredible voices we want today simply require more polyphony.

Yamaha is a HUGE corporation. If they really took the arranger keyboard industry seriously, they could throw $1/2 billion into development and completely dominate the market. They won't, but I still can't wait to see what the 10,000PRO (for lack of a better name) will be like.



[This message has been edited by Stevizard (edited 03-08-2001).]

My argument was its educational value. Here is a keyboard that breaks music down into 400 essential elements and allows you to fiddle, I mean manipulate, each one in real time to hear the effect for yourself. This advanced musical knowledge would be of great musical value to our children and cheaper than the tuition and other expensives in learning the same material in another way. (Don't ask me how well this worked.)

Nice to see that all our american friends
like the new VA76.I knew that the man who
said Roland keyboards are too difficult for
americans was wrong!

76 keys is all well and good. But why deosn't Roland address the problems and concerns alot of people are talking about with the awkward inability with the Touch Screen to navigate thru the keyboards features when playing in a live situation? It seems the general consensus prefers buttons vs touchscreen.