Hi Diki.
Sorry James, but having struggled for years to make translated styles sound as good as the originals, I'm afraid once again I have to disagree. You yourself probably know that the sound and the performance are inextricably linked. Change the sound, and the performance needs to be changed. Sometimes in a large manner. You know all too well that, I would have thought.
Ok, I get where your going here but your still thinking CLOSED Keyboard.
Yes there is a link because the sounds on a closed keyboard are very limited by the number of layers of samples they have. Most sounds will have only 1 layer, some bigger sounds might have 2 or 3. Because of this there is a sweet spot where the performance played on them will sound best.
When converting styles from one make of a keyboard to another, the sweet spots in the performance many not match up to the sounds used, and so on... which is the entire basis for your argument here.
The problem with that is though you are thinking totally CLOSED Keyboard minded. You don't take into consideration the fact that a premium VSTI will offer sounds that don't have anywhere near the limitations of a closed keyboard. You get sounds that are FAR more detailed here, large samples, more of them, many times more layers.
So why do you think they won't sound as good as the original sounds on a closed keyboard preforming the pattern ?
Imagine using Pianoteq as your source for all Piano and Rhodes sounds ? It's so detailed that the midi standards actually limit it by what it could actually do.
As good as they are, until someone actually DOES make a coherent soundset and a few hundred style (what 99% of the arranger market is looking for OOTB) for an open arranger with an OS that IS geared towards the users of closed ones, I just don't see this flying.
I agree, I've said more or less the exact same thing in this thread a number of times at this stage. This is exactly why I've been saying that I'm delighted to see that Lionstracs are marketing the new keyboards at the workstation market.
The thing is though, if there are any arranger users out there who are technically minded and like the idea of surpassing the standards of a closed arranger, then an OPEN keyboard is the machine for them and there are huge benefits to be had if you put in the work.
You have to do the work yourself because as I've already said countless times in this thread, there is no such things as a VSTi Arranger that comes with it's own sound engine and content. None in the same sense as a VSTi Synth comes as a load up and instant play piece of software that requires no additional work.
Lionstracs could very easily make the Mediastation or the new keyboards typical arranger user friendly. It's just a matter of pairing the arranger with a quality vsti synth and having someone with the skill to do the work optimise 2 or 3 hundred styles taken from the net.
The catch with them paying someone to do that though is that they can't sell the work once completed. They would have to give it away for free because of copyright law on styles. So is that worth the cost to make the keybaord more typical arranger user friendly. I don't know.
I'm sorry, but you nailed it, for me. You said YOU wouldn't be able to take the time to program the hundreds of styles you might need as a gigging pro (or even a well rounded amateur). And I'm sorry, but I don't think you would want to spend the time making hundreds of translations, either. Especially once you got to hear how poorly they fare when compared to their originals...
No, don't twist my words. You where taking about writing new styles. Writing styles is far more effort than just downloading the best of the best collection from the net and remapping the sounds.
Remapping sounds is something I could do very easily, but it woudl be illegal for me to sell that work due to the copyright on styles. I'd have to give it away for free.
This is why I've said in my previous post to you that the only way you will see the type of OOTB arranger that YOU expect from Lionstracs is if they pay someone to do the work and they turn around and give it all away for free.
Simply doing that so they can sell keyboards to people like you is not the total solution either. A VSTi of premium quality would need to be purchased as well.
Come to think of it, you have an Oasys AND a PA, don't you..? Now SURELY, you ought to be able to translate all the PA's styles over to the Oasys and build Karma setups that could do much of what the styles do. But your not crazy enough to do that, when you already have something that does the job MUCH better. THAT'S really the point I've been trying to make.
Well actually that would disprove your point quite simply because the OASYS would instantly make the styles sound better even if I just recorded the midi out of the Pa1X into the Sequencer and remapped everything so the OASYS sounds were used.
I think I've got a few songs on my mixing desks HDD where I've actually on this with a Pa1X and a Triton Studio. Possible even my OASYS. I'll see if I can pull the songs out.
Sure, you COULD use a Swiss Army knife as a hammer. But why would you, if you already had a hammer?
If only you where living close by and you could visit the Studio. You totally don't even acknowledge your own abilities Diki. I think you just need a push and the opportunity to see what can be done and you be a changed man.
Regards
James
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