Cajan, I did not compare the two.
This new M-Audio controller offers assignable sliders, buttons, knobs and pads..These are an advantage over the Roland A-37. It also is bus powered via USB. The Roland is not.

Roland is 76 keys, the M-Audio 61.
They both have a good key feel[not as good as the G1000].
The Roland has 128 set up memory, the M-Audio does not.

The M=Auio has 4 zones, the Roland 2..

The Roland has a durability track record, the M-Audio[line] does not..

Hi Fran,
are you saying that these knobs/sliders could be used to trigger variations, fills etc instead of using the keys or computer keyboard??

best wishes
Rikki
p.s.
By the way , thanks for the post, I visited the site & found an update for my soundcard driver. My latency issues are solved with the new laptop, I'm down to 2.9ms.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Fran Carango:
[B]
There are enough controller knobs , sliders , pads to set up the arranger start/stop, fills , intros and endings, and variations..I am pretty sure we could even assign our favorite styles to pads etc..

Fran: thank you for the input. I finally compared the "Axiom" and the "Oxygen" (these names!) -- slight differences. On the key feel, I could tell little difference, and since both have (the same I think) aftertouch, no biggie there. The key design on the Axiom (full white key boxes) implies a big change, but I am not convinced. Knobs and various controls almost the same, a few more complex things on the Axiom, but not needed by me. I think I'll stick with the "Oxygen 49" for a while. It should suffice. I am not using it as a substitute for my PSR9000, but as a toy in my office, for noodling and composing.

Rikki: yes, that is what Fran is saying -- the keyboard takes the place of the computer keystrokes. For both notes played and for commands. Read any good description of a "MIDI controller" and you will see how it works.

I just finished testing both with One Man Band and Jammer Live and this new KB responds very nicely, almost no latency. I have also set it up in Ableton Live and in Project5 and it appears ready to work there as well.

Hi Cajun,
thank you. Sounds rather interesting. I noticed they also have smaller controllers with audio . They , I assume act like a soundcard . Be handy having soundcard & controller in one portable package.
I'm really only after a tiny controller I can doodle around with ( as you put it) and that i can pack up and take on trips etc My Digital piano & Sd1 keyboard aren't too portable haa haa.

best wishes
Rikki
[QUOTE]Originally posted by cajun100:
[B]
Rikki: yes, that is what Fran is saying -- the keyboard takes the place of the computer keystrokes. For both notes played and for commands. Read any good description of a "MIDI controller" and you will see how it works.

Rikki:

When you find out that most of the popular MIDI controller boards weigh less than 15 lb. (in 61-key form) and even less in 25 or 49-key forms, you may be more interested (mine weighs 7 lb.). Also prices (discounted) in the range of USD$100-$300 for very capable boards. I chose the 49-key form because it fits most desktops or typing desks without throwing everything else out the window, and still has room for all the controller knobs. And it is so light I can unplug the USB connect and move it instantly.

"Audio" is not built-in, however -- as in full or partial arrangers. There is no sound chip in controller keyboards. Every sound is dependent on your sound card and MIDI software connections. Such as OMB.

There are many competing brands of MIDI controller boards. Go online and look at M-Audio, CME, E-Mu, Korg, for examples of popular choices. Download any manual and you will see a variety of controller key-knob-slide combinations available. There are a few reviews on Harmony Central and elsewhere -- not as many as would be useful, unfortunately.

PS: here in the US it is "noodling" -- (from jazz players' use of the term years ago); "doodling" refers typically to little drawings made on note paper, during meetings, etc.

Hi Cajun
I was refferring to something like this http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/Ozonic-main.html
I was hoping instead of using 2 items , my Audiophile soundcard & a controller keyboard with my laptop/softsynths , I might get away with just the ozonic.
On the site it's listed under Mobile Recording along with my audiophile, so I just assumed it did a similar job??.
I probably used the wrong terminology, I wasn't after something with sounds.
I'll check out some of the others you mentioned.
best wishes
Rikki
Better get my glasses out, I thought you wrote doodling ( haa haa) noodling is one I haven't come across before.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by cajun100:
[B]Rikki:

Rikke:

I understand now. I think you are in fact referring to the "controller-synth" boards, which tend to be 2-3 times more expensive than a plain MIDI controller board. Perhaps more , in the case of top-rated Novation and others.

These keyboards have -- I believe -- all of the MIDI controller functions AND a built-in certain number of "synth voices". I assume these are in fact various popular synth sounds for playing a melody and/or solo, depending on the KB size, etc. I personally have not yet seen one in action.

Since you would have to be connected still to the computer w/soundcard, VSTi stuff, etc., OMB, to really play completely with thythm, I myself see no great advantage for extra expense, except for convenient playing around with "synth" melodies without any backing. I do not believe these KB have sampling for onboard storage, etc. Might be wrong there, check reviews of latest.

Myself, I am new to the world of soundfonts and all of the variety that this brings to the arranger scene as well. I doubt I will be investing in another full-fledged arranger KB again.

Hi Cajun,
no, the ones I'm reffering to, don't have sounds, I think they just have an audio interface. They're more expensive than a midi controller, but not as expensive as Novation which do have sounds. Novation's not what I'm after as I'm also happy using soundfonts.
I get 10ms latency with the new laptop, but with the audiophile usb soundcard ( with asio driver), I managed to get it down to 2.9ms. I'm hoping that a midi/audio controller keyboard will give me similar latency, without having to use 2 seperate pieces of equipment.

best wishes
Rikki

ps don't know what sort of soundfonts you're collecting, but I've managed to get some quite interesting ones thru a company called Soundbrewer. They've done some of the old synths like M1's, Matrix 6 etc not terribly expensive either.

Rikke, hmmmmmmmm. That's a fairly decent reduction in respose time moving from the external sound card module to the integrated board. Definitely worth considering ... but I guess one has to measure that $$$ against upgrading to a faster, more capable laptop.

The problem I have with things like controller boards "upgraded" with addons like integrated audio interface circuits is whether the hardware is durable enough. Most MIDI boardsa re not exactly famous for quality control, 'cept ther eally expensive ones. I might prefer stuff where I can replace a major part fairly easily (like the sound card). I have friends using the SFF computer boxes (the extra small boxes) as replacements for laptops. For music use -- since they really don't use the computer keys -- they simply have the box (with a good soundcard integrated), and the controller keyboard plugged in via USB or Firewire. And a nice flat panel display. Another approach.

Thank you for the soundfont link. I need a lot of information and help as I make the move into component softmusic. I'll be back.

PS: have you ever tried KeyRIG from M-Audio? It's an interesting simple idea for someone not requiring many voices and a lot of effects. Like me.

Hi,
I had considered an sff computer.
It was all too complicated. I could buy the barebones??, but then I had to try & sort the rest out. The dealers here seem to sell them in bits & pieces. I just don't know enough about computers to try & make sense of it all.

If you need some links let me know. Maybe start another topic as we have hijacked Fran's posting. Sorry Fran.

No, I haven't used Key Rig.
best wishes
Rikki





[This message has been edited by rikkisbears (edited 07-10-2006).]