I noticed with certain persons posting their recorded songs there is almost a boasting and condescending tone when they are describing how they did it.

Now I have know problem with explaining how a recording was done but it is almost like it is a bragging right and the best thing to record in one take directly from the keyboard with no post editing.

My take on it is if it is a recording that is going to be put up over the Internet, and if a recording is in the hands of the listener for as long as they want it, then putting out the best recording should be the most important thing.

If you were recording a live performance of you at a gig then what the listener gets is understood to be a live gig performance.


Just because the keyboard allows for hard disk recording does not mean IMO that it should be the way to display recorded playing over the Internet. This seemed to have started happening with the hard disk recording feature on the Tyros 2 but there was hard disk recording way before the Tyros 2 in the form of the Genesys. But I did not see the Genesys users feel the need to do what the Tyros 2 users seem to be doing.

If I am going to post a recording, I would use specialized products to do the job. Although there is hard disk recording on some arranger keyboards, that is not the keyboards primary job and there are other tools best used for recording (i.e. computer software).

I would not even start the style playing vs. the midi file/mp3 file debate since we all know that they all do the same thing but the amount of live playing depends on the user. I could do more live playing with a midi or mp3 file that a person playing with styles could do.

At the end of the day, if a person has a recording of someone’s music, he or she really does not care how it is done but only that it sounds good and brings out some type of emotion.

It’s the same concept with a live gig. At the end of the day, persons don’t really care whether you are playing with 0 or 1 fingers or 10 fingers, but as long as the music is good and that you are entertaining them.


This is not to bash any keyboard brand or any person but just an observation.

I can tell from your wording you are possibly referring to myself and a few others on SZ.
Saying I've done it in one take is not braggig at all so sorry if anyone get's this impression, it's just me telling the listener exactly how it was done.
If I wanted to produce an album which I am doing, I'll do it in my studio with PC etc and master it myself until I am 100% happy with it.
Many SZ users want and have asked to hear what can be done on a T2 or another arranger when played live with no fancy editing or use of MP3/SMF backing, so I tell people exactly how it is.
I do see where you are coming from though and I value your opinion on this matter.

Point Taken.

I think it's very pertinent to say it was recorded in one take. I could spend a week on a song and I guarantee you it would sound far better than recorded in one take. I don't consider it bragging at all.

------------------
Bill
Yamaha PSR2000

When I recently posted a song, I listed the details, including the "one-take" info. It was not a boast as you claimed. I wanted the reader to be aware of all parameters I used so I could share how I created the performance to encourage constructive comments, of which I received several. Posting what the on-board HD recorder captures without any post-processing represents what can be done live. I don't under your adversion to this practice. For me, I would want people to post this way most often so I can learn about what can be done live with the arranger. And I appreciate that they tell me of this honest approach.

I think you are putting too much importance of posting a recording to the internet with your use of "specialized products to do the job".

Remember this is the arranger forum. Sharing arranger output is most appropriate. If your interest is heavily processed music, perhaps you should look to participate in other forums.

It's just music. Do it, enjoy it, and share it.

As I crossed over the bridge I saw a man fishing with a drop line, he didn’t have a fishing pole and his clothes were worn.

I live right on the ocean in a large home with many emanates and some great investments, but -- I could not help thinking that the man on the bridge is possibly happier than me. He seemed to have captured a feeling that I have overlooked.

I love hearing all music from lest of musicians to the best musician. They are sharing not to be judged but of offer something of themselves.

In my grand days of performing professionally with my guitar I killed them with my guitar abilities. I had so many years of schooling and pro work behind me I did one great job.

BUT---- I always stood in amazement when I heard a black man playing an old beat up guitar and using his thumb instead of a pick. He held the guitar in the wrong position and did not follow the rules of perfection.

BUT--- his music was precious. He was playing music from his heart and committed many musical errors, BUT ---- He was good, I could not get enough.

John C.

PS, No, I do not have an ocean front home, nor was I that good at playing my guitar, BUT – it added to my story. Aaaaaaah. Life is good.

Very well expressed, John.

I agree wholeheartedly.

Ian



------------------
Remember to leave good news alone.

its this constant over analysis and the recent spate of back biting and bad blood between fellow musicians that has discouraged me from posting anything on this forum. I will hold my peace until some semblance of normality returns. It will return .....wont it ?????

John, I love a good story but I'd like to point something out to you. Using phrases such as the above, no matter how well-intentioned, REALLY DOES help reinforce racial stereotypes. See, in the above example, there is no reason to mention race other than to create the perfect image of the "poor, untrained but supremely talented, (and by inference) unsuccessful, musician". But why say all that when just one word can sum it all up.

I'm sure, from reading your other posts, that you meant absolutely nothing malicious by it, as MOST people are completely oblivious to the fact that they are inadvertently reinforcing the type of stereotypes that shape our attitudes towards people that are (superficially) different from us. I seriously doubt if any Native Americans want to be perceived as "noble savages". Believe me, it's just a "feelgood" thing to (from our lofty perch) convey these mystical powers on members of the underclass.

Sadly, we seem to get no wiser with age. I know that this not the correct forum for a sociology lesson but I think any opportunity to re-educate (in a positive way) should not be missed.

Peace,

chas

PS: Black, when used to depict race, should be capitalized, else it means a color (such as cyan, magenta, blue).

[This message has been edited by cgiles (edited 09-01-2006).]

This thread was not started to be part of the recent negative postings by a few members.

But I wanted to under score the importance of having a good recording whether it be for an arranger demo or workstation or what ever.


You see, one of the purposes for going through the recording process is to make allowances for the different environments and musical equipment (i.e. speakers, music player’s soundcards …) that people would be hearing the music through.
In a recording. You want to make sure that it can do justice to the music in different settings.

I did not want to single out any one person or instance but I have to do this for an example. There was a post a few days ago where some persons, when listening to an MP3 version of a recording thought the drums were not powerful enough. The poster and another person with whom he gave the actual wave file to thought the drums were the right level. So it appeared the post recording process mattered here.

What I am trying to say is that just a one take no processing no nothing recording probably would not capture every thing or most things that the poster would like the listeners to hear. This would cause the listeners to make comments about the poster’s rendition that the poster would not agree with. This could be because the poster and the listener could be hearing 2 different things. This in tern could cause tension between the poster and some of the listeners. May be this could be one of the causes of all this bickering between members?


To use an analogy, you probably would not use the same mixer settings on your arranger/mixer/speaker to play in a small room that fits 50-60 persons and a big auditorium that sits between 500-600 people and has a high roof.

........ sorry to do this, but I had written a reply that, as good intentioned as it was, I realized that it would probably cause some contoversy... that was NOT my intent, and there certainly has been too much of that lately ...
t.

[This message has been edited by tony mads usa (edited 09-01-2006).]

Well Tony, if, after re-reading it (whatever it was) you decided that it might convey something that you didn't intend, then that's a good thing. However, no need to over-censor all your own posts; I'm not THAT thin-skinned. If I were, I would have committed suicide years ago.

Peace,

chas

chas ... since you 'opened the door' ...
and let me preface by saying I think I am one of the LEAST contoversial guys on this board - too old and wise for that stuff ... and I am saying this in a non-combative, non-sarcastic, non-contoversial tone, but rather in a gentle conversational manner...
I was just going to say that John was painting a picture with words as to what he saw through his mind's eye ... The fact that the fellow was Black was part of that picture ... nothing more ... nor did it bring anything to MY mind other than the scene he was describing...
Now, I realize that you can say I cannot relate, because I am not a person of color (is it ok to use that phrase - I am not being facetious, but I just do not know what is acceptable these days), however, as an American of proud Italian heritage, I did not take offense when rbmusic posted his "song for gumbas" ... perhaps an "opportunity to re-educate (in a positive way)" was missed on that thread ...

I sincerely hope you do not take offense to anything John or I have said ... And I think I can speak for John in saying that there was absolutely no mal-intent on either of our parts ...
and Peace to you as well...
t.

OK,
The black man I mentioned was part of a real visual, it was not just part of a made up story.
I thought about changing it and decided not to. You see what is in my heart is the area of admiring the man with a bit of jealousy on my part because in all my perfection I had not achieved what he had achieved.

Chas, as far as your comment, It is more than welcome, I still love you so there. Hahaha

John C.

"There is none so blind as he that WILL not see".

I don't know how carefully you read my thread, but I'd say that you missed the gist of it. Because of the above quote, I'd say further discussion of this is pointless. I think what I was trying to say was pretty clear if read with an open (ie. non-defensive) mind.

John, Tony; I know you're both good people. I have no desire to create such an environment of hyper-sensitivity and/or political correctness that no one feels comfortable expressing their thoughts, feelings, and ideas. Having said that, I also feel that there are very few instances on a board such as this, where race or ethnicity would be needed to ensure clarity.

Tony, please re-read my post,....slowly and carefully.

Thanks,

chas

Chas ... I do not feel that I read your post with a defensive mind ... nor did I appreciate the quote directed at me ...

That said, I do not want to carry this discussion where it is not intended to go, by any means... For my purpose it is ended, now ...
Peace my friend ...
t.

[This message has been edited by tony mads usa (edited 09-01-2006).]