Dennis, thanks for the implied offer for help. Yes, I understand that the G70 is a very European keyboard and there is a lot of help across the pond.

Fran, this is all your fault . I like your comment about being familiar with the OS thru previous arrangers. That certainly is a BIG plus.

For Diki, Tarkington and others - any thought that I would just go into this arranger stuff lightly shows a lack of understanding on your part. I could play this thing all night without a hitch or complaint, but then I'd be settling for what is THERE. I'm upset over what isn't there or at least easily seen or found. As Fran points out, a lot of this stuff is learned over years of working within the Roland OS concept. So maybe he, Diki, Miden and others have a better understanding of the in's and out's of this monster than someone like me who hasn't had a Roland arranger. I incorrectly assumed that my experience with Roland synths would make this chore easier - not the case. I believe that anyone without previous experience with this Roland arranger OS would be asking the same questions I have just because the info is not readily out there IN THE MANUAL. Yes, I'll give you the fact that maybe I need to start using and saving UPGs; that seems key to saving what I DO want, but there are questions that don't apply to user settings, like global settings that aren't there and adjustments to parameters that should be there, but don't seem to be.

The G70 is one helluva keyboard; it has features that I will never need or use and that's OK. But what frustrates me are the features I assume are there, but I can't find. I give you G70 gurus credit for being able to rope in this mustang and only ask that you try to understand that there are others out there who have simple questions that require complicated answers, and you probably have the answers without even realizing it because you've already been thru the learning curve. So help us out instead of telling us to READ THE MANUAL and ASK QUESTIONS on other forums. What you know is NOT in the manual. What I want to know is NOT in the manual, I think.

After sleeping on my rant, I've decided to start posting questions about the G70 here and at Roland-arranger.com. I'm hoping I can find out (learn) what I need to know thru that technique.

So I leave those of you who know anything about the G70 with this question (#1): Can I adjust and save "vibrato-chorus" parameters in the drawbar setting? I am not satisfied with the chorus settings, especially C-3.

Cass, try an insert effect #83, for your Leslie/vibrato/chorus settings..You should be able to adjust for your needs..

Thanks Fran. I knew you would have an answer. Now if you'd just explain what that means and what will happen.

Hey, cassp.... I am surprised at how long it has taken you to get around to asking the actual questions that are bothering you. I also find it astonishing that, coming from a synth background, you STILL haven't even bothered to learn how to save programs (UPGs), probably the most fundamental thing to learn on ANY programmable keyboard. Get an XK-1? You'll STILL have to learn how to save your presets (like if you want to change the Leslie character, hint hint...)

Ranting only gets you so far, and is easily avoided by posting your questions at roland-arranger.com BEFORE the frustration sets in..!

But seeing as how this is posted here, now, I'll deal with it here... Unfortunately, Fran's answer is only partially true. MFX#83 can only be inserted on regular Tones, NOT the HB (drawbar) section of the G70 (which is what I believe you were really asking about). So there is no way to edit the Vib/Cho of the HB section. You CAN select V1-3 and C1-3 and store them to User Presets, but you can't change the actual CHARACTER of the HB Chorus, nor it's depth (which is all the Vib/Cho Vintage parameter in the MFX seems to do, IMO). The HB section appears to be '60's' only. A REAL VK Organ offers you access to these parameters (but you would have to learn to save them, in any case!).

There are only a few regular organ Tones that don't already have some Vib/Cho sampled into them (which ruins them, as far as I am concerned) to use with the MFX rotary effects (and MFX#57, the VK rotary doesn't have the Vib/Cho section), so, other than those few tones, you are going to have to get used to the Vib/Cho sound in the HB section, I'm afraid... (I checked the sys-ex codes, and these don't access those parameters, either).

If you are using your G70 in a recorded project, BTW, I would suggest laying the organ down on a separate pass to other Parts, and turning all reverb OFF. The HB's reverb send is pre-Leslie , so if you want an ambient Leslie sound (don't we all!), put the reverb on to the organ part with a plug in (or track through an external reverb).

But, in future, try to post your problems BEFORE you get to the point of wanting to sell your arranger... OK? Trust me, you will find no other arranger any easier to use, on the whole. Even far less expensive arrangers (and less capable and live-sounding) will be no less complicated, and if you aren't going to be happy with anything less than being able able to tweak whatever parameter comes to mind, no less complicated arranger will make you happy either.

You've got a quandary, don't you? You want microscopic editing detail, but you want it simple too...

Best of luck with THAT one...

Thanks for taking these questions under your wing. As on my other post, your answers are right-on.

Ranting? Who's ranting? I was ranting? No, not me. You must have me confused with someone else.

Your insight into the drawbar section is an eye-opener. So, even though the drawbars themselves are the same as the VK engine, the effects, ie. leslie and vib-chorus are not quite the same. Aha, I see. I knew that

And gee, dad ,er, I mean Diki, I promise to practice saving those UPGs. Please let me have some ice cream tonight?

Hey, Diki - thanks a lot!Here's to YOU, kid.

Cheers, cassp.

And there I was, thinking I might pick up a nice cherry G70 for peanuts as a backup, and now I've gone and ruined it!

Serves me right!

Oh, never say never.


...so they say

Cass, if the edit parameters are important to you.

Select the VK organ[draw bar],
and turn off the offending parameter[vibrato]..
or all of the effects including Leslie simulator..

Now route the organ to separate outs...
from there using patch cords ..route that signal back into the audio ins of the G70..

Go into effects /audio in effects/ and select #57 ..now you can adjust and use any para mater you want with the VK organ..

Fran, Fran, Fran.... What are we going to do with you? (just kidding!)

The HB section CANNOT be routed through the Direct Outs (or panned off to one side if you are going mono). Perhaps you could TRY some of these 'answers' you are giving before you post them..? I know you mean well, and it's great that you take the time to post, but perhaps take just a LITTLE more time and find out if you are right, first...

Sorry, no emoticons (or ice cream) for you tonight, young man! Now, back to the manual...

OK Diki, now for G70 ..102[as in class]..
Naturally Roland screwed up when they made this VK without separate outs..

How I got around it[and no , I don't think it is worth the hassle for a vibrato selection..but possible].. I come out of the main out..I used a mono 4-1 Rolls mixer..routed it into the audio in..I had to only use the vibrato control of #83 insert...not the Leslie[because of some looping]..I used the VK effects for everything but the vibrato..From the 4-1 Rolls..I continued to the amp..

Would I ever use this?...NO..Will it work ?..YES

Cass , also there are many great organs you can also use with the insert effect..and layer them with the VK..minus the vibrato..This may give you pleasing organs too..

No one said the G70 wasn't flawed..Matter of fact , when I decided to buy a G70 [Version3]..I was under the impression we could use the VK organ in our styles..not to be...same with Guitar mode!!
I still haven't given up on trying to figure away to do this...but like most things missing..shortcuts aren't worth the trouble..Recess time....