Yesterday, there was a post here on the synthzone discussing the Yamaha DGX305 and the DGX505 models. The discussion followed with posts of a model which could have more of the current PSR3000/Tyros features. One member listed the pros and cons of the DGX keyboards and as I read these my thoughts were exactly the same. Wouldn't it be great to have more tracks to sequence, a style recorder, more polyphony, etc.?

I would like to ask the members of this forum for your thoughts as to whether or not a keyboard with the DGX305 and DGX505 key touch and a 76 and 88 note keyboard would be something you would want to own, and how much you would be willing to pay for products like these?

For many years, I've discussed my customers needs and desires for new products with Project Managers working on arranger keyboards, and often I've seen my recommendations implemented on new products.
I thought with such a big audience here at the Synthzone, I could really find out what the majority of you want. I remember several years ago talking with Yamaha about building a 76 key or 88 key arranger. Not too expensive, and with a moderate price tag. Yamaha asked "Would customers buy these models without weighted keys?" My answer was "yes, if the prices were not to high". These models have been winners throughout the country. At their current price points, they are great values.
Could a DGX type keyboard with PSR3000 features and with a piano type action, not with a weighted keyboard be something you would be interested in owning? Mega Sounds, 16 track Sequencer, Vocal harmonizer and all the other features currently found on the PSR1500 and PSR3000 should be included.
How much would you imagine having to pay for a keyboard with these features?
I would suggest about $1500.00 for 76 keys and $1995.00 for 88 keys.
Do you think this would be a good target price?
If Yamaha is considering a Tyros with 76 keys, like the 9000PRO's keyboard, would you prefer the 76 and 88 Piano Type keys found on the DGX models? Also, keeping in mind that a Tyros Pro keyboard would probably sell for twice that of the DGX type keyboard I am suggesting.

As a store owner, I know I could sell more keybaords at a more attractive price but I also need to know.....how important is the key action?
Should an 88 key model have weighted keys vs light piano touch keys and at what price?
Is it OK for the 76 key to be lighter keys but still shaped and sized larger like a piano? My thought would be weighted on the 88 key version and lightly weighted on the 76 key. This would also keep the cost of the 76 somewhat lower I should think......What are your thoughts?
Thanks in advance for any thoughts you might contribute and I promise to foward any of your comments to Yamaha for their evalutation.

George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

George,
Excellent question. I Think Yamaha would really benefit from making a 76 key and 88 key version. That would really be awsome. Weight and size may come into play, but it should really affect it if the keys aren't weighted, but like that of the DGX series. I think your price of the two models is a good start.

Squeak

George,

Great post! Yes, I would buy a PSR-3000 with 76 or 88 keys, and all the features you suggested. However, whether the keys are weighted or not has never been an issue with me. I don't care one way or antoher because it will not make me a better performer.

As for paying $1995 for the extra keys--NAH! I love the 3000 just the way it's packaged. Could have a couple extra buttons that were omitted from the 2000, but just the same, I love this board. The weight, size, OS and all the other features put it, IMO, at or near the top of the arranger list.

I was talking with a friend a few days ago and he said "Can you imagine what this board would have cost just 10 years ago? I paid nearly $3,000 for a PSR-5700 when they first came out, and compared to the PSR-3000 it was nothing more than a glorified, electric piano with a few styles. If they would have made the 3000 back then it probably would have cost $10,000 and no one would have blinked." He may be right.

Gary

George,

I have also seen DGX 505 at the stores, and think that it has an excellent form factor - 88 keys WITH speakers under 30 lbs. It would be an excellent value for under $2000, if fitted with the electronics of the PSR 3000, and so would be the (less expensive?) 76 key version. It is light enough to carry to gigs, and many of us with proper piano training (which excludes me) will surely be glad to have the extra keys, and of better quality than the PSR 3000.

However, Yamaha's most recent attempt to integrate the piano and PSR (PF1000) is both heavy and expensive, at >$3000 with basically PSR2000 electronics. I don't think it has sold well for those two reasons, even though its sound system is more powerful.

Let's hope Yamaha listens to your suggestion - while I am still looking forward to replacing my G1000 with hopefully another Roland, a DGX-style keyboard that you suggest may work for me as the second tier, to provide an all-in-one solution to take along to smaller house parties, and provide the variety of tones and styles.

Please keep advocating our needs to the manufacturers - we need them to know what we want before they embark on design exercises.

Regards,
Alex

The problem I have is in determining what the actual definition of: fully weighted (piano hammer action), weighted, semi weighted, and synth action is.

Some people refer to weighted as what the Ketron SD1 and Yamaha 9000pro keys are, while others refer this to only mean fully weighted 'piano hammer action' keys which Fatar claims to have patented: http://www.arbitermt.co.uk/studiologic/hammer.htm

I personally expect a keyboard which 'claims' to have weighted keys to have at least the weight & feel as the keys on a Yamaha Clavinova or Technics Ensemble Digital Piano.

I classify the key feel of the Ketron SD1 and Yamaha 9000pro as 'semi-weighted', and the keys of ALL currently produced 61 note arranger keyboards as merely synth-action.

George, that being said, I expect an 88 note arranger keyboard to have fully weighted keys similar to the Yamaha Clavinova/Technics Digital Ensemble Pianos, and that 76 note arrangers have (to keep it more portable) semi-weighted keys similar to that of the Ketron SD1.

I also prefer the shape & size of the keys to match the size of standard piano keys.

Scott

I would prefer to see 76 keys 'semi-weighted' as per Ketron SD1. Yamaha 9000pro & Roland VA76.

Scott,
The keys on the DGX305 and DGX505 are not even like those of the SD1 or PA1XPRO. These two keyboards actually have metal weights under the keys. I think the DGX series are only shaped like piano keys and are closed in the front like piano keys rather than those narrow synth type keys of the PSR3000 variety. Clavinova keys are what I would call hammer weighted keys.....the feel of a more heavy weighted piano.
I sell the Casio Previa keyboards with a very good Clavinova type action and these only weigh 27 lbs. and the prices are very low. I am hoping Yamaha might be able to develop a keyboard to use in a new model with PSR3000 features, keeping the weight and price down. Even if not, having the 88 DGX505 keyboard would still be great in my opinion.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

I'm not a piano player, I've learned to play keyboards on the psr series so to me bigger weighted keys feel strange. But...
This may be a little bit off topic but I would like to see a keyboard that can show a text file on the screen. So you could add words to styles as well as songs but without doing it the karaoke way, one word at a time. I'm sure most of us don't need the "bouncing ball" to follow I don't even need all the words, keywords to follow would do.
Of course I would still want it priced right.

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I for one LOVE hammer-action weighted keys...and all 88 of them, but I come from a strict piano background. I think if the 88-key arranger had these it would cut out many of the organ players out there.

How cool would it be if they offered both key types and buyers could choose which they wanted?

Carrie

dgx 305 keys and action and atleast 1 GOOD ac piano sound (without aftertouch if they can't ),(min 20-22 watts like pa80) speakers,psr 3000 board,1 more input for instrument,weight under 12kg and they will sell like pound cakes.

cause the only reason that 305 is not outsolding say 1500,3000 is lack of 4 variation ,style creation and pads.people care less about 6 trk seq when the have a good looking(non cheapo look and feel-except for the buttons)SM equipped machine with plays mid file/styles with no loading.

it also look like a good investement(looks good in living room) and the look doent age as fast as 2k,21k,3k stuff-the rear has only YAMAHA logo with decent and expensive look without the model number (like expensive EPs) ,good piano box keys mean it can make/inspire you to learn and play unlike thin short keys.

so 3k board,above features sell under 1500 or 1700$(no need for 88 key model) they will outsold roland and korg cause yammy' only major problem now is the keys and built quality these days since competitions are still 2 times more expensive9WAY OVERPRICED)- and lack of vital realtime features.YAMMY can sell tens of thousands.