They are! I have lived in Germany (Munich) for two years, in the early 90', and got the impression that country music is extremely popular over there (at least at that time)! Lots of country music live bands.

-- José.

Hi Scott,

it is true that Germany has a great selection on some realy good styles, I must say though most of them are far from Oompa pa music, even though they are out there.

Europe is big on Dance, Techno, Hip Hop, House, Rave.... etc.
There are a lot of one man bands in Germany. Almost every party will hire one. Of course it is expected that they play the latest tunes as well as some oldies and for the older generation a few Oompa pas are a must.

In Germany Arrangers are viewed very differently and KB magazines give them excellent reviews, year after year. As we discussed earlier, most families have some kind of instrument at home.

Since there are so many people in Germany/Europe that play arrangers, it is no wonder that they are taken in consideration when programing styles.

Eric

[This message has been edited by Eric, B (edited 04-25-2002).]

Nice comments from everyone .

Defending the arranger .......i am not going to get into it ! dano

Hi Eric,
Sounds like a trip to Germany is a MUST for us 'American' arranger keyboard players. It will be a welcome switch to be appreciated by other pro gigging musicians for a change. Here in California (at least in my area), arranger players are far and few between, but then I guess that's what makes gives us the marketing edge.

Great reading everyone's feedback & comments on this thread. I knew I could rely on you guys to help cheer me up after feeling bummed out from Mr Colbeck's snootty anti arranger commentary . I feel so MUCH better now. Keep posting everyone. - Scott

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http://scottyee.com

I agree with all of you 100 percent. However, the Italians who make the Ketron X1 put way too many ethnic European styles on it to suit me. Of the 98 styles on bank B about 20 of them are usuable for the usual American croud. Too many oom pa pa's. Thank Fran and some of the others for providing us x1 users with additional styles.

Hi Scott,

most stores in Germany carry high end KB's, for the reasons mentioned above. But just like here, not every sales person is as knowledgeable or enthusiastic as George or DanO about their KB's.

Maybe you and I will team up some day and go to the Frankfurt Messe. They have ALL KB's that are out on the market, not just the new stuff. The demonstrators are pretty good to.

If you book early enough you can get pretty good airfair. My wife was just in Germany for a surprise visit for her Mom's birthday.
I couldn't go, but she payed only $350.00 roundtrip and $100.00 for a car for one week.

Not to bad

I must say for myself, that I have a blast playing my Pro everyday, and that I have a whole band/orchester at my fingertips, no matter what anybody else says

Keep on swinging

Eric

I read the article and I have the magazine and I really liked some of the ideas he presented.

For example, he liked the sweet flute and the solo nylon guitar very much. I agree with him that those were the best of the best sounds. However, he missed the sweet trumpet which I thought to be the best ever sound in the PSR series from PSR740 to PSR9KPRO. HOWEVER, as an American, I expected that an American will not appreciate the sweet trumpet sound as MUCH it deserves because (AHEM, please take my comments with grain of salt, this is only an opinion ) of the influence of JAZZ, big bands and other styles of music. I like the trumpet MORE in easy listening and classical music than in Jazz or bigband. But the point is that he hit the nail on the two other sounds.

I also agreed with him when he said that although PSR9K has additional professional features, they are not subsitute to dedicated sampler for example.

However, the following takes the cake:

“I’ve noticed the arranger-keyboard fraternity expects Style providers to trawl popular songs for inspiration. That fixation on existing song material is annoying and one of the reasons why such keybord have a bad rap among pro musicians. If arranger-type instruments provided feels and grooves that were fresh and free, their appeal would be broadened. Of course, my opinion is one of personal taste, if you play dinner sets in a hotel lounge, you’ll porbably be extremely happy with what the 9000pro has to offer”


Well, he clearly missed the point. STYLES are not primarily created for NEW MUSIC. STYLES is for performing FAMILIAR MUSIC. If you want to create new music with new edge, simply modify some styles, write your own or do not even use styles for that.


But I think I know where is he coming from and here is what I have to say: if you want to sell a "PRO" musician an auto-arranger keyboard, I will not recommend Yamaha keyboards. I will recommend GEM keyboard instead. The reason for that is that when you record GEM styles in the studio, they do not sound like they are coming from an auto-arranger keyboard unlike Yamaha keyboards. Yamaha auto-arranger keyboards sound like an auto-arranger keyboard and therefore they do not fit for professional recording of songs. I believe this is what Julian wanted to say but could not articulate it and thought it was simply an existing song material issue.

My 2 cents. As usual.

I just bought my 9000 Pro from a regular poster here and I'm enjoying it very much. I haven't read the EM review of it yet but I did read the Keyboard magazine review last fall (October I think, but the review is not online), which was done by a person who does commercial music beds for a living. She was very nice and gave a good bit of praise on the 9000's features and sounds, but she spent a lot of the article talking about how she used the 9000 Pro to sample and remix some music for a project. That's all well and good but I don't think the 9000 Pro is really meant for studio use. Studios keyboardists and film composers wouldn't use half of it's features really, nor would keyboardists who play in bands. Without the built-in speakers, I don't see home users jumping in line either. It is quite clear to me that the 9000 Pro has one market in mind in particular: wedding singers... for them, the 9000 Pro is a money maker. The music database function is full of examples of songs needed for instant audience gratification at weddings and parties... even the dreaded "Chicken Dance". And in the MIDI setup is templates for using the 9000 Pro with a midi accordion. Need I say more?

I keep starting to reply to threads, and then read what I've written and it's so cynical-sounding that I delete without posting.
I drove to Books A Million and read the entire article, trying to find something positive. I found a couple of things: I'm positive Yamaha spends a lot of money with them so they probably have to write the review. I'm positive the guy knows nothing about the way real-life people, both pros and hobbyists, use Arranger Keyboards.
Now I don't have to delete because this is a positive comment.
DonM

[This message has been edited by DonM (edited 04-26-2002).]

I played 4 jobs since I got rid of my psr2000, and I did not use the arranger ONCE, since then. (Mostly because the G7 is pretty weak in pop styles ... but OH those polka's !!!)I played left hand bass, piano (RH) and used the drums .... alone. I was happier than I've been in ages, and I got paid the same money as I would if I had a rack of gear up to the ceiling!
The feel of the keys gave me back a comfort zone that I had lost with the 2000, and that is why i was able to play the whole night without the aid of the arranger. I didn't even miss it a little. I LOVE playing my own bass lines, and to tell the truth - there is a simple beauty to that "trio sound" that gets lost when you add all the bells and whistles in the arrangement section.
All these tools have thier places in our shows, but I am happy to report that nothing can replace the "live" energy of human hands. I've said this before, but it's worth repeating -
Turn OFF those accominiment parts sometimes. No one wants to hear a full orchestral arrangement in every song. Treat your listeners to the "rests" They are a BIG part of music, an too often forgotten, and ignored.
So, it looks like I'm back with the trusty old G7 till further notice. This means that for important jobs, I need to bring my rack bag (for the harmonizer), but for the little 1 hr stuff, the mic input in the keyboard is working out just fine ......and that BUILT IN mic stand boom - it's UNbelievable how cool that is. EVERY keyboard should have this as an option. It's a real space saver.