I like a fair amount of the PA800 voices against the T2. Particularly the synths ( huge edge to Korg there ) and to a lesser extent the organs and strings. That said, I think the reason I preferred the T2 against the main competition is that I make sparse use of the style parts, and I tend to place a lot of emphasis on the panel voices, especially the guitar sounds. I also often prefer to flavor the styles with the multipad pieces and turn most everything else off except the bass and drums..

For whatever reason for me, when I play it, I can get the T2 to sound more like the real thing I guess.... articulations vs Roland's guitar modes and whatever tricks Korg uses .. etc. Since I got my T2 a little over a year ago, even though I still bring the laptop to the occasional job I do, I no longer feel the need to plug in the VST instruments and sample sets I have in it.

If I was looking toward the styles themselves for more substance, then I suspect that for me the T2 would come in dead last.

I'm in what appears to be a huge minority who likes the overall Korg OS better than Yamaha's, but I would very much miss the way Yamaha's multipads work. Along with the T2, I still have and use both my old but very customized PA80, and my MZ2000 for it's superb synth engine, and I think that's gonna do it for me for quite some time.

AJ

I find myself agreeing with both Mikey and Dave's "negative" comments..

I personally do not like the PA800 or Tyros2..for several personal reasons..

Mostly because I do not find either to compete with features I think are superior[for my needs] on the Roland G70..

Acoustic pianos are superior on the G70..

Organs are superior on the G70..

Scat and choir voices are superior on the G70..

Vocal harmonizer is superior on the G70..

Key feel is superior on the G70..

Effects and routing is superior on the G70..


The above ..is reason enough for me to pass on the PA800 and/or Tyros2...

Features I find interesting on the PA800 and Tyros2..

Recording capability to record audio with in the instrument..Korg to USB device..and Yamaha to hard drive..

MP3 capability on the Korg[optional]..

Particular sounds from both Korg and Yamaha..

Don't get on my case for stated my opinions...You do not have to agree with me..Donny and Dave are my friends..so if they can live with my opinions, I can't see why others can't accept difference of opinions..

Hi AJ,
I've actually had some issues with the psr multipads ( the repeating ones like piano phrases etc)ie if I don't hit them at the right time , I get them playing catchup or I even end up with a blank bar ( maybe I've got some sort of setting wrong) anyway , how do the way the korg pads function compare to the Yammie pads.
Don't mean has the yammie got better pads than the korg, but moreso the way they're triggered & perform.

I'm trying to find out if they work in a similar way to the kn's.


best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bluezplayer:
[B]

I'm in what appears to be a huge minority who likes the overall Korg OS better than Yamaha's, but I would very much miss the way Yamaha's multipads work.

I've played the:

Ketron SD1+
Korg PA1X, PA1X Pro, and PA800
Yamaha S900, Tyros2
Roland G70 & E80

Though I agree with Mikey on some points, but not on others about the PA800, I feel ALL of the above keyboards I've played are terrific keyboards in their OWN right, and capable of sounding the way you want (if only you take the time to because master the OS, navigation, sound editing capabilities of the board, of which then gives you the ability to make the keyboard your own and sounding just the way you want. Unfortunately for some, this is'nt possible in a week, or even a month, and full mastery may take much longer.

You can nit-pic about this feature and that, but the bottom line is, like the techique & art of keyboard playing itself, it's all about putting in the time (woodshedding) to master the many features of these powerful technilogically advanced keyboards. If you don't have the time to do this, dedicatication to a single solo instrument may be better suited. Just my opinion. - Scott

Hi,

not seeing a difference in quality between Pa800 and Pa1X (that I own personally) seems to me strange. I judge their construction far better than any Tyros or Yamaha arranger (especially Pa1X of course). And the new Pa2X is arriving.

Want we compare Korg keybeds with Yamaha products (especially Pa1X) ? Do we really need ?

Regarding sounds: I respect any opinion. It's a matter of taste and we can spend thousands of words without coming to an end.

Regarding styles: compared with the "kind of plastic" Yamaha styles (for sure used as reference) they seems to me much more musical, alive and inspiring. Anyway I respect opinions also here.

IMHO in this report there is not too much open mind against non-Yamaha instruments. Fortunately a lot of other post here in SZ seems to point out the quality of Korg arrangers. I don't want to say that Korg is the best (even if it's my choice), but the market has a lot of good arrangers from different brands, not only Yamaha.

I've tried them all (Yamaha, Roland, Ketron), as kindly suggested from Mickey, and found my choice. Thanks for the warning, anyway.

Just my thought.

Regards.

Possibly the most important thing you ever said, Scott! If someone grows up playing Yamaha, then all oif a sudden gets a Korg - it will seem like the whole world is different. Same for all brands.

I remember the first time I heard a drum machine with real PCM samples....I HATED the cymbols, because they didn't sound like the ones I was used to in my Korg analog machine. After a while, of course, that feeling went away and I can not go backwards anymore.

We have a saying at my school:
"You have to GROW, or you have to GO".
Stretch a little - get out of your comfort zone and explore the magic that lies in all these new instruments.

Well said, Scott.

Dave great post.......fair & balanced

Fran.......we know the G70 is on par in quality ....if they can only get the weight & size trimmed down is the only way I'd consider one again for my gigging needs..plastic doesn't necessarily mean lesser

Mickey I was a bit surprised at your review also not knowing what OS was in the pa800 it shows when it starts on screen....I hated the T2, design too wide & those sharp corners ripped thru one of my keyboard bags.
The vocalizer is sub par at best in quality. The Music Finder doesn't retain & save Transpose where Korg's is so far superior & editable. There's more but Im sick of mines better then yours scenarios its too early for that

I will admit the Pa800 NEEDS a heavy dose of tweak/edit initially regarding the master mixer, also I have found that the fantastic on-board speakers need to be shut off when playing live with a PA because they are TOO GOOD and real block out the mains in a tight situation.....if your mains are way up front then as a monitor the speakers would be fine or alone in a small gig situation "more then enough" .

Booby nice post I agree.

You're right about the timing issue Rikki, but on the T2 I only notice it when no style is playing, ie I use two or more pads at the same time. When a style plays, the pads seem to pick up the cadence fine. Then again maybe I've just gotten used to deploying them at the right time when I'm playing.

I agree with those who are from the school of thought that no one arranger is the right choice for everyone. I also agree with the folks who say that we see little discussion about folks digging in and using some of the power that all of these boards have. It would seem that we tend to want to look to what might happen a year from now instead of using what we already have. I still, however, have my 2 dinosaurs and use them often.

The PA80's multipads are good for use as on / off controllers, not much else, but the styles sound great, and I made adjustments to some of the fills and they seam together with the main variations much better. Some of the panel voices are excellent, unfortuantely for me, the guitars and pianos aren't ( so subjective tho.. ). I've spent a good deal of time customizing the board for me, and have dug deep into it, and probably because of this, I didn't feel the need to run out and get it's successor.

The MZ2000 has no multipads, and it's styles could be better ( a lot better in some cases ), but it does have a great synth engine onboard and some surprisngly good panel voices, ( nice synths, guitars, saxes, and organs w/ sliders for the drwbars )given the amount of sampling rom, along with a chord sequencer that other folks would love to have on their modern boards. It also has an onboard style conversion utility ( Roland and Technics format ) that works pretty well. Mine has quite a few good sounding converts in it.

Still, both boards were approaching 6-7 years old last year, and it really WAS time for something new. When I went looking and ultimately chose the T2, I had a few specific thoughts in mind. Multipads that I could actually create and modify, and use in real time, and excellent panel voices so I didn't feel compelled to use VST's for live play. For me, the T2 satisfies both needs, and I'm gonna stick with it for quite a while. Also a key factor was all of the third party stuff provided by very generous folks like Michael P Bedesem and Jorgen Sorenson, along with many other resources. These utilities were among the past positive experiences I had with my earlier PSR's that led me toward a Yamaha, but this is the first TOTL Yamaha arranger I've ever owned ( I did have a PSR 9k for a brief time in the studio on loan ).


I'll also admit that I do get some kind of a gear lust thing going on every time I see the G70 and E80 at my local music shop. For the current year though, my gear lust hasn't cost me quite so much. My main purchases were a relatively inexpensive acoustic guitar and soon to be the Software RealStrat app from Musiclabs. The latter sounds ( and looks ) awesome on the video demos and I hope I can master it enough to get the same sounds.

I think the old cliche is true though, about one man's junk being another's treasure, although none of the current boards are junk, but I guess some might perceive them that way. Because of the priorities I stated above, neither the PA800 and the G70 would have worked as well for me, but that's an individual thing because of what I felt I needed in a board. Everyone else's priorities will differ, so I think it's best to keep an open mind to that when we ( sometimes so rigorously )explain our purchases here.

Regards,

AJ




[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 09-17-2007).]

Thanks AJ,
I'm wondering if maybe the PA800 pad system has improved since the pa80?

They have some really great pad creation functions like midifile to pad, style track to pad (& vice versa)etcetc

I beleive you can also play more than 1 pad at a time ( a bit like the psr system) except that you have the option of a looping pad syncing from the next bar or from anywhere within the bar immediately.

I beleive you can also trigger a pad via a foot pedal? not an option I have on my psr, or at least not that I've found in the settings.

I suppose the only way I'll satisfy myself as to whether it suits, would be to try & check one out. The manual makes it sound perfect for someone like me, for likes to delve into a keyboards functions. haa haa

Might try & get a hold of a pa80 manual & do a comparison on the pad functions.

thanks AJ

best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bluezplayer:
[B]
The PA80's multipads are good for use as on / off controllers, not much else,

Hey Mikey,

Thanks for the review:

No color display / Bad key feel / Sound not any better than the S900 ?????

Maybe it`s time to give the S900 another try.

I thought for sure that it had a color display , and I would have thought that it would have shared the same key-bed as the M3 ??

Guess not

Now I really need some help !!

What about the Tyros you have ?
Do you have the Tyros Spkr system? If so , sound good ? Metal Grills or cloth.

Minor details , but @ 4K I need detalis !!

Many thanks,
Gary