There is rebellion in the camp and it seems well justified.

What I mean by that is, there has been repeated discussions about the Tyros' Vocal Harmonizer on this and many other Forums. Tyros owners have been and are complaining that the VH on the Tyros is distorting for no apparent reason. That is; not because of any malfunction on the User's part, i.e. bad Mic, Mic volumes adjusted wrong, cheap Cables, etc.

Many of the Tyros owners also own the PSR 9000 or the PSR 2000, etc. and they (me included ) do not experience any distortion on the 9K or 2K such as they (me included) do on their Tyros's Vocal Harmonizer.

Which has many Tyros owners up in arms because Yamaha touted the Tyros' Vocal Harmonizer as superior to any prior Yamaha Keyboard.

So why are there multitudes of Tyros owners complaining about the Tyros VH then? >>Because it is NOT superior I suppose.

Here is just an inkling of what people are saying about the their displeasure with the Tyros VH:

Tyros vocal harmonizer error
Posted: Friday, October 29, 2004 10:35 AM (EST)
Hello Guys,

Following is my third attempt to reply on this subject.

I have addressed Tyros VH issue on various forums in recent months....incl the Yamaha supported site "Arranger Workstation Forum"

I have had lots of feedback & suggestions from members... but very little from Yam on the subject. I am a long time user of Yam products & currently have 8K 9K & T ......I can confirm without fear of contradiction that 9K VH works well....whereas the VH on T..is indistinct...lacks seperation & distorts to the point of being unusable.

Unfortunately I dont think enough users are complaining on this issue, so perhaps Yam believe if Ignored it will go away.....& so it might.....and so might some of their customers.

I, for one am not going away. Yamaha Advertised Tyros as havig "Stunning VH" so they should stand over that claim.....they are certainly in breach of their contract with customers if they don't......and have breached all advertising regulations. I see no reason why I should purchase a seperate VH unit when I have already purchased one in /with Tyros.....the responsibility is with Yamaha to correct the issue.

Perhaps there is an opportunity here to collaborate.....perhaps a little VH from disgruntled users might have some effect on the big Yam Corp.

So guys lets not let this issue die..die..die..(is that VH I hear)....a little more harmony & we just might get some results.

And as a famous man once said..quote " if you're not with us...then you're against us " unquote.

Thanks for listening & hope that's not the end.

LeoD (located..Rep. of Ireland)

_____________________________________________

This is just the tip of the iceberg IMO. I feel many other Tyros owners are perhaps too timid or lackadaisical to really pursue the problem with the Tyros Vocal Harmonizer malfunction/distortion issue. If we rally the troops, maybe we can convince Yamaha to provide a fix much like Scott Yee did with his constant bombarding of Yamaha with the "Repeat Fill to Self" function that was "missing" from the Tyros yet was ON most other much "less" expensive Yammie Keyboards.

>>> I agree with Leo!

Yamaha "Steve" are you listening?

This issue should NOT be swept under the rug by Yamaha!

The Tyros is OS updateable and Yammie's programers should work diligently to provide a "fix" IMO.

I experience the same 'distortion' and I'm disgruntled about it also. There is a bug with the Tyros VH and our $3,000 dollar Keyboard deserves to be bug free!

Steve, PLEASE pass this info on to Yamaha Japan. I'm sure they're aware of this problem but if we keep reminding them maybe they'll do something about it.

And hopefully soon, instead of waiting what seemed like an eternity for the Repeat Fill to Self feature to be resolved.

Btw, many thanks for all your help in getting the Repeat Fill to Self feature added to the Tyros Steve.

PS: You do want our business Yammie, am I correct? Then you should do everything in your power IMO to get it - and more importantly to "keep it". Don't advertise one thing, and then not correct it when the statements are not true and accurate. Instead, Yamaha should "fix" their mistake.

Best regards,
Mike

Yes, let me add my voice to that. I previously had a PSR 8000, and had no problem using the VH. But with my Tyros .... distortion is not the word .... it is trully unusable. I don't think that any paid performer would even consider using it. I'm not a singer, but I do employ singers, and was very upset (though I just live with it) to find that the VH is absolutely unusable. I can't even overemphasize it. I'm overall happy with Yamaha products, but I can't understand how they were not embbarrassed to release it as is.

I also doubt we'll hear from them. Firstly, I assume that it is a hardware problem. Secondly, talk has already begun on a new Tyros, so I doubt they'll be paying any attention to this.

But it doesn't hurt to let it out.

Chony

I had mentioned the same thing, a while back and everyone told me I must have the gain too hi or using the wrong type of adapter and overdriving the VH input.

Come on Yamaha , you made a great product, great OP system, (except for limiting reg's to 8) why not let it go to greatness status?

As both a nearly 2 year old Tyros owner & former PSR2000 owner myself, I've NEVER experienced 'out of norm' VH distortion problems with 'my' Tyros. In fact, in a side by side comparison with the PSR2000,the Tyros harmonizer was dramatically improved (clearer more distinct harmonies).

Mike, Chony, Frankieve: I suspect one of two reasons for this possibly occuring on your Tyros keyboards.

1) Microphone (brand/model) used:
My experience has shown that a mic which includes a very high (HOT) output) signal is most critical when used with a keyboard built-in VH harmonizer unit. The hotter signal going into the board the less you need to boost the signal with the mic trim knob (back of the keyboard) or mic volume knob (on top of the keyboard). My question is at what level do you have the 'mic trim' and 'mic volume' knobs set at? Both of mine hover at around (more or less) the 1:30 position.

I've tested several mics with my Tyros and found that Electro-Voice brand mics provide the highest signal output, and deliver the best VH results (without distortion or harmony dropout). I recommend the model ND767a: http://www.electrovoice.com/Electrovoice/products.nsf/allpages/937B84C17B940EBE 86256B96005D42AD

2) VH Harmonizer (defective part)
If the mic knob settings or low mic signal output is not the issue, then, if you have updated to the latest Tyros OS 1.40, I would suspect it to be a Vocal Harmonizer HARDWARE problem, and perhaps a bad production run that may have included a batch of faulty parts.

I recommend that each of you email Steve Deming at ycasupport@yamaha.com and OFFICIALLY report the problem, as:

"that's the ONLY way" you have a chance of getting your Tyros VH problem fixed.

Yamaha will then assign you a case number. Keep track of that number. The more cases of this problem Yamaha receives the sooner they will act. I know because I've gone thru this song and dance routine.

I admit I had to hop, skip and jump thru at least a few hoops and wait (a LONG time (months) ) but Yamaha did finally come thru, acknowledged & corrected the Tyros USB hardware connection problem I was having (and thankfully with Yamaha covering all expenses (including shipping) as well . If the problem indeed is a wide spread (faulty) hardware problem, I'm pretty sure Yamaha will cover it under warranty, even if your specific unit is past the warranty period. At least that was the case with the USB hardware problem I encountered.

Good luck and please keep us informed.

Scott

Scottyee,
I am encouraged to hear that youre VH on T works , as I'm one of those guys who has worn fingures from postings on this issue...I've had numerous suggestions made by users, and I have addressed the issue with Steve of Yamaha and on the Arrangerworkstation(Yamaha site)...but as yet have had no satisfaction whatsoever, or Yam acknowledgement of the problem. I also have started a Poll on the issue ..which is not getting any response...this to me is very strange as I know that there is a problem out there ...as you suggest it may be confined to a Prod. batch & not all Ts ..but the prob is MAJOR to anyone needing VH facility
I have also been quoted above on this thread.
I can also state that I use a Shure SM58 which is specifically named by Yam as most suitable for T..

As has been said on this thread WE..with the problem need support from Steve / Yamaha
& at the moment that's not happening

LeoD


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LeoD...Committed to Live
Performance & use of M.Pads

Leo, I'd like to help, but the SM58 works great on my Tyros. The VH isn't as good as the external units, but to me it works as it is supposed to. But I've always been lucky!!
DonM

I've tried using both my SM58 and Beta 57 mics and got major distortion regardless of how low I set the gains related to the harmonizer.

I then tried an EV MD 431 and found it to be much better than the Sure mic. However, at times, I STILL found some distortion occurring.

A few months ago I gave up on it and bought a used external harmonizer. I'm very happy with it...

Bill in Dayton

Mike,

Have you removed all effects off of the Vocal Harmony?

Early on, Yamaha recommended removing these effects since the Vocal Harmonizer and the Effects processer are the SAME!!!!!!

That means valuable CPU cycles are being drawn from the DSP processors when Effects are used.

Try that and let me know how you make out?

Al

I've come to learn that the Yamaha mic input is stingy. It only "likes" even, moderate signals and if you shout, or push a vocal .... it overloads. I had to revise my style of singing ( which really BUGS me )during harmony usage. It's an inferior system to the standalones, but it's not a malfunction. Just sing ez and steady and don't push it or it'll sound like crap. If your vocal styling is too dynamic, like mine can get .... you need to either calm down or use something else.
It's not broken....just mediocre. I opt to use it in a reduced fashion in stead of lugging more gear, but my the studio - it's never used. I have a TC Helicon and a Digitech that work great.

Hey people! I don't mean to be rude, but some of you just don't seem to be reading what we're writing!

Its not the mic. Its not the input. And its not just "mediocre". IT IS BROKEN!! The kind of distortion levels I am getting on this machine - are crazy. As soon as you add VH and / or effects to the original voice, it suddenly sounds like you're listening to yourself through smashed speakers!

Okay, now I'm calm(er).

Chony