I've had my g70 for about a month or so and I have a few questions. I think there are answers at least I hope so.

I'm still looking for a good 4/4 ballad for songs like "After the Loving", "At Last" and so on. I'm tired of these brush ballads that come stock on the g70. Something you can dance to.

When I do "Mustang Sally" a break button would be nice. Is it possible to get a break without hitting the off switch?

When I turn on the drawbars I get some preset sound that is not to my liking. I have to turn off the overdrive leakage and percussion to get it to sound good. How do I get a setting I like to be there when I turn on the drawbars?

What style would you use to do "Sweet Home Chicago"?

I'm looking for a good shuffle for "You Don't Mess Around With Jim". Can't find a stock one.

How about a style for "Midnight Hour"?

How can I use Intro 3 and have style one play after the intro?

How do I prevent the One Touch buttons from changing the left hand parts?

When I up the drum volume on a style that setting seems to carry over to all styles selected after. How do I prevent this?

Can I copy parts of a style to create a new one?

Has anyone found the cover feature useful for anything?

Can Leslie effect be added to some of the organ sounds that don't have it?

Sorry for all the questions.

thanks in advance,

Tom

Tom,

I use either Slow Rock or 6/8 to do "After the loving', and At last, just find the tempo that right for the song. As far as "break" you have to assign break function to one of the assigned button, hope it helps...

------------------
Tye

Tom,
I suggest you to ask your questions in this forum: http://roland-arranger.com/
and you'll find a lot of G-70 expert people ready to answer.

Tom, reading your post only makes me smile that I sold my G70. I had many of the same questions and asked them here and at roalnd-arranger.com. The bulk of the answers suggested I read the manual. That, of course, doesn't help does it. I decided that I really needed to understand the Roland OS before attempting any sound or style modifications.

I can say that most of your questions can be answered by making your own registrations or editing those that are there. Make sure you have a memory card and save all your stuff there.

I can say that I found the COVER feature useful, but only a couple of them. There certainly is no for a dozen. I used one on the first page and another on pg. 3, I think.

I found the drawbar ssection to be a handful. I know what you mean about calling up sounds that are in need of tweaking. The experts will tell you to edit - gee, thanks guys. I did not like the fixed setting on the vibrato/chorus and there is no way to change them.

In all, I really liked playing the G70 a lot. But, now that it's gone all I really miss is the 76-note keyboard and the Fantom X piano. Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Truthfully, Fran Carango was most helpful and so was Diki.

Tom, I have a new G-70, too. Comparing it to the Ketron stuff I've always played, I'm really disappointed. Break functions...everything you mentioned is a problem.

In my mind, the general design and sound quality just doesn't meet my expectations.

I may donate it to a youth center. The Midjay and controller I got from Don, even though not new, is far superior for my needs.

Generally, I'm pretty disappointed. Ketron remains my brand of choice, even though i have some resevations right now about a purchase at this time. Like the SH-201 and GW-7 for my purposes, though!

BUMMER!


Russ (looking forward to visitors Friday night)!

Russ, if you decide to donate the G70, I have a suggestion for you. Have to be in private.
I think that if you work with it though, you'll like a lot of things about it.
DonM

Thanks, Don. I think the G-70 is not what I need. I've maxed out my donations for this year, so it will be on the list for 2008. Even the limit of 7 foot pedals is something I will have trouble with. I'm going to use the 13 note pedal with the Midjay.

The drum break function is a reall downer for me. Use lots of drum breaks. I understand the work-around, and that's just bad design, in my opinion.

Hey, I took a chance and it didn't work out. What else can you do with no dealer nearby?

I've been playing Ketron/Solton since the early auto orchestra days. Everything else I see comes up a little short, in my opinion.

Of course, that's just my opinion, and shouldn't influence the choices of anyone else.

One of the few things about getting older is you can be obnoxious as hell and no-one can do anything about it. I just don't like the damn thing.

SO THERE!


Russ

Thanks, Don. I think the G-70 is not what I need. I've maxed out my donations for this year, so it will be on the list for 2008. Even the limit of 7 foot pedals is something I will have trouble with. I'm going to use the 13 note pedal with the Midjay.

The drum break function is a reall downer for me. Use lots of drum breaks. I understand the work-around, and that's just bad design, in my opinion.

Hey, I took a chance and it didn't work out. What else can you do with no dealer nearby?

I've been playing Ketron/Solton since the early auto orchestra days. Everything else I see comes up a little short, in my opinion.

Of course, that's just my opinion, and shouldn't influence the choices of anyone else.

One of the few things about getting older is you can be obnoxious as hell and no-one can do anything about it. I just don't like the damn thing.

SO THERE!


Russ

Sorry-hit the button twice. Don't like the touch screed either...AT ALL!

R.

Russ ..how about a half donation...I will give you a grand for it..

Firstly, I would recommend you get an FC-7 pedal. I find running a G70 without one very difficult, as there are not enough dedicated buttons on the front panel, and my hands already are busy enough!

To a certain extent, the RT*M advice is good. Most of your operational requests ARE spelled out fairly clearly in there. For instance, saving an HB (B3) section preset, (p.34), etc.. The index is your best friend! But be careful! The G70 has gone through two MAJOR upgrades, and several of it's more important new functions are not in the main manual (not unless they have reprinted it since OS1, which I haven't heard about). There are PDF's at Roland (and roland-arranger.com) for both OS2 and OS3 additions. If you don't have these, yes, it may be confusing to find out some info!

A 'stop' or Break function can be set to go there, or can be assigned to the ASSIGN SW (reasonably convenient for the LH). This is on p.18 of the OS2 addendum.

To use Intro 3 and then go to VAR 1, you press VAR 1 button, then Intro button, then VAR 3 button (button 1 should flash). You then press Start or Sync Start, and bob's your uncle! (p.26-27 of the main manual)

The Drawbar setting can either be stored to the registration (UPG) you are working in (p.110), or if you need a library of presets to chose while you are in one UPG, you can store the HB presets and overwrite the ROM ones (p.34 main manual). But be warned, these presets are stored in the UPS, so must be re-created for each UPS (User Program Set, a sort of master list of 192 registrations).

Copying Parts for assembling new styles in in the Style Composer section of the manual (p.185 main manual)

Most of your questions seem to involve using the G70 in a 'live panel' mode, which, although do-able, runs counter to the way that Roland have slanted the OS. They REALLY work their best when you knuckle down and create a specific UPG for each and every song, or AT LEAST each and every way you prefer to use the keyboard. And things like the OTS have their own specific behavior... they are basically over-riding UPGs, and as such, you can't just hold the LH. Sometimes, with such a specific need for a certain tune (you don't want to hold the LH Parts for ALL songs, do you?), you can write a pair of UPGs, and place them next to each other in the Set List, and switch seamlessly.

There's probably a couple or more ways to achieve almost anything you want on a G70, but being darn near Roland's flagship (the E80 is based entirely on the G70 OS, with some newer additions), it is a VERY deep and intricate machine. A lot of your requests seem simply answered, others are more complex, but you sound like you have come from another manufacturer's OS, and somehow expect the Roland to do exactly the same thing, exactly the same way. Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way, my friend...

You move from ANY manufacturer to another, and you are going to have a shift in thinking and workflow. And, unfortunately, reading the manual carefully, staying up-to-date with all the addenda, and spending quite some time with the arranger and manual in hand, investigating all it's intricacies is part of the process. Whether Roland, Korg, Ketron or Yamaha (amongst others!) is what you came FROM, any other is going to involve the same amount (roughly!) of study. Several of your questions were answered with a simple look at the manuals' indexes, and there it is!

About the only way you can move to a TOTL arranger from another and NOT have to go through this is to move from one model to another of the same manufacturer, and even that (say you go from a PSR2000 to a T2) is going to involve more than a month of (not ) reading the manual methodically..!

As to the styles... well, AFAIK, no arranger has the perfect style for EVERY song, and coming from another, you always have your ears attuned to one style. But either you CAN find something that WORKS (even if it is not the same), or there are a wealth of older G1000 and earlier styles, and conversions from other manufacturers out there (maybe even the style you USED to play it on!). You just (like the rest of us) have to go out and find them...

Don't be in such a rush to change, or you'll find yourself returning to where you came from, and obviously, you DID hear something about the G70 you liked! If you need change, if you need a different sound, that ALWAYS comes at a price, no matter WHAT arranger you change to!

Don't give up... things WILL get better!

Diki, I have the pedal.

R.

Russ what is it more specificly that doesnt suit your style of playing with the G70? We can all learn from your experience.

I guess, for me, it boils down to the SOUND...

I am prepared to rethink my workflow if the sounds are SO good you HAVE to have them! For me, this meant losing my beloved Chord Sequencer (although many remain on the G1000 just for that one feature!), and a boatload of work to tweak my older styles to match the new sounds, but I gained a grand piano that is, IMO, the best in the business, drums that are the best in the business, and a VERY usable B3 simulation (not as good as Nord or XK-1, but still better than most arrangers short of Wersi and MS's VST B4 organ). These are the core, meat and potatoes sounds that MUST be as good as they can be, otherwise I start to wake up and realize I am playing with a machine (I like to pretend I am not!)...

Sadly, you go back to your Ketron, you got to go back to the Ketron sounds as well. They are not bad, and 'liv-er' than most, but I still got to give the edge to the G70 in most categories, and the fact that you DID change makes me think you heard it too, Tom.

But the fact that you are asking some fairly simple (at least, SOME of them are simple!) questions that are answered by the manual makes me wonder... Did you EXPECT it to be easy? Sadly, it rarely is...

There's always roland-arranger.com, and here at SZ, but nothing substitutes for cracking the manuals, and being methodical about learning a new OS, I'm afraid. Or, back to the Ketron, and forget about any further sonic and operational progress, sadly...

Diki, it comes down to preferences. I don't like the Roland sounds and programmed rythems, period. I've listened to multiple demos, and I don't like what I hear. You do, and that's fine. I also don't like some of the features.

I bought the G-70 because I had a problem with the Ketron organization and business practices, not the equipment. My expectation is that major time is required and the best outcome is a product that his sub-par, at least for my tastes.

I made a purchase mistake...so what? I've wasted enough time. Time is in extremely short supply. I make time/value judgements every day. If I wanted to reduce the learning curve, I'd get a Yamaha, which I dislike (ALL Yamaha arrangers) worse than the G-70.

It's all preference. I'm not right for anyone else, but I'm right for me.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!


R.

No worries, Russ. Actually, I got confused and was addressing Tom, but thinking he had the Ketron (what DID he come from, BTW?), not you.

I was just a bit more concerned about the fact that several of those questions were answered by the manual, fairly easily. I'm pretty sure you (Russ) have figured out pretty carefully what works and doesn't work for you, but Tom's questions seemed a bit unresearched, and I'm just trying to counsel patience if he HASN'T exhausted the manual and places like here and roland-arranger.com.

That is all... You might answer the same way if someone was talking about giving up on the MidJay, when it was obvious they hadn't read the manual, yet! Now, some of Tom's questions WEREN'T easily answered by the main manual, but some of them WERE. And, despite the ribbing, both here and at roland-arranger, we DO answer as many questions as we can, but no-one likes to be used as a substitute for reading the manual, we like to feel we come AFTER that process!

Everybody has to use what they are personally the most comfortable with (no arguments there!), but if you are unaware of many aspects of the OS, you'll never know IF a particular arranger WOULD work for you or not!

Russ Id jump on Frans offer fast


He'll even come get it

Ps ....we need a road trip anyway Russ.

Tom, you might give this page a good going over. A LOT of really good tips and advice from G70 owners...
http://roland-arranger.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=category§ionid=4&id=20&Itemid=56

Thanks everyone. Diki, I bought the g70 sight and sound unseen and unheard. I trust recommendations by people like yourself. I also trust Roland to make a TOTL board.

The only manual I have is on the CD that came with it. I think it has version 2 on it. It may also have the version 3 update.

Every keyboard falls short of our needs and expectations. It is just which short falls are least annonying to each of us.

I do believe that the g70 is a great board. The vocal harmonizer alone makes it almost worth it. I have not givin up on it. That's why I've waited so long to ask questions.

I'll take all of your suggestions and try to put them to good use except one. I've stated I want a 4/4 ballad and people keep suggesting I use a 6/8. I don't want a 6/8, get it?

One last question, if there are converted styles from other boards where can they be found. Please answer this privately by email. How about the style cd on Ebay? Has anyone used it?

Thanks everyone,

Tom

Tom you have mail

All the latest manuals, and update instructions are available at roland-arranger.com. There are fora where users post self created user styles, there too, along with sound tweaks, and UPGs, etc..

Come on down...!

And, actually, I prefer the PDF manuals, as they are more easily searchable than printed ones. The index is OK, but not comprehensive, so an electronic search will often give you pages that the index forgets.

Why no paper manual (you need SOMETHING for the 'smallest room'!)? You buy it from a dealer? He owes you one...

Most of the frustration that comes from moving manufacturers comes from wanting to do something the same way one always has, but in truth, as long as it CAN be done, you can get used to anything... It just takes a little time and patience.

First things first, Tom... I would read up and learn as much as you can about saving UPG registrations. And then putting them in the Set List. Then, whenever you get the G70 the way you like it, save as a UPG, and all your hard work is recallable... After that, we'll get down to the nuts and bolts, OK?

Hasn't it occurred to anyone that many users don't do well with manuals. I, for one, am more of an audio learner and also do better when I can see what someone is talking about. Or when someone answers the question directly as I asked it, not something similar in a book. It's not that I can't or won't read the manual, but that reading it doesn't give the needed result. I would much rather ask a knowledgeable SZ member how to do something than try to figure it out from reading the manual - that doesn't work for me. What surprises me is that the Roland owners seem to be the RTFM people. Yamaha's strength is in its easier OS and large 3rd party help base.

Cass, that's not true..I don't believe I ever told a fellow user to read the manual to a direct question...I may answer[if I know the answer] , and confirm my answer with a page number from the manual..

Now you must admit we all know people that rather ask a question instead of searching the answer in the manual..

Most of my friends are like that...not mentioning names or references [like new pop pop]..."D

The manual is a good addition to your already knowing knowledge of how arrangers or any unit works depending on your experience....it is not an only source to learning a unit...most are written poorly.
Some day when these manufacturers start to include all Level Instructional QUALITY Produced DVD's for all their products, sales will increase, end users will find more enjoyment in their units, music will flourish & people will be happy because they can learn more about their instrument by watching & reading combined.

Probably won’t be good for the manufactures, (And is probably why they don’t include them) as if uses find they can achieve what they want with their existing keyboard, why should they upgrade. (Not good for sales)
In an Ideal World every board would come with a DVD, but unfortunately we live in the Real World.

Bill

Bill its a sad state of affairs regarding this topic for sure...again its all about Money to hell with the buyer once the soak you as usual.....it really sux...Wersi open architecture & upgradable OS does address some of these issues but not all. Seems like a big marketing game that keeps revolving year after year while they all laugh their way to the bank, for example after the T2 there was no need for a S900 which is so close to the 3k..they could really took it up a notch with a much better featured unit for sure ....but I guess they had to sell all the left over parts & bait everyone with a few Sa voices etc etc ...so now in a year or so they will come out with something so called new and it all starts all over again! Round & Round we go to the poor farm....at least if you make a living playing these things you recoup your initial purchase investment many times over....but the home player gets skunked every time. Lets see what is in store in the next few months after NAMM.

Take care

Folks, I've decided to keep the G-70 around for doing film score roughs. I'm not going to gig with it, but it will be a useful tool to access rythems and sounds for the work I do. It will stay set-up and that will eliminate shifting equipment around at that point in the process of film production. The equipment I use out is in a different area of the warehouse , left at a house job or in a vehicle. The product using a G-70 will be more than sufficient to do the roughs like the one I just sent Donny. And I'm sure it is a superior performance board for many.

Like I said, it's all a matter of personal tastes, and the G-70, while a much better than average board, isn't for me. It'll be a good work board, though. If Donny posts the rough I sent him, you'll see what I mean.

Diki, I REALLY appreciate your input and admire your commitment to your craft. I think it would be a ball to do projects together.

Knowledge and passion are admirable traits.
Taike and Chas are friends, and I know you've had run-ins with both of them, which bothered me. This proves, however, that you can make your points in an intelligent sustainable way, even when there is a fundamental disagreement involved, and do it with class.


Thanks,


Russ

Fran, you are absolutely right. YOU have never been one of those RTFM guys. Your advice has always been helpful and to the point. Thanks for your help and friendship.

yeh man, I got it

Status report,

I'm making progress. I created and saved my first user program. I feel a little like Uncle Dave, just give me about 10 good ones and I'll be happy.

Also some kind people sent me a slew of styles. I've found "IMHO" some much better ones that came from the Roland e500.

I programmed the break function into one of the buttons but this has to be done everytime a style has changed. I also put it into my UPG.

I love the slow blues style that is included in the jazz and blues section. I use it on the Beatles tune "Oh Darling". I'm still looking for a faster blues style to use on "Every Day I've Got The Blues". I know it is somewhere, I just have to find it.

I've started on tweeking some of the styles. This I think will take a little longer.

Thank you to all the folks who sent me styles and offered help.

Tom

The Break/Mute function assigned to ASSIGN SW should NOT change if you change styles... only when you change UPGs (registrations).

There are a couple of workarounds... If you are creating ALL your own registrations, start from a blank template UPG with controller assignments set up and saved the way you like them, then you won't have to enter these things.

OR... you could get a copy of the Session Manager software at Roland-Arranger.com (it's fully functional, you only pay to get expanded batch processing, so you can try it before you buy it - and it's cheap, too!) and copy the controller destinations, split points, yada yada yada to as many registrations at the same time as you want. It is virtually indispensable for PC G70 owners.