Curious to know if anyone has played live with this board, through a PA?

I've been thinking of adding this to my studio and doubling up on jobs like tonight (younger, bigger crowd at a lake pavilion). The 800 is just amazing with its depth and awesome styles, sounds. Wondering if the Prelude would be as 'rich' in its overall character.

Thx for any thoughts and comments.

common zuki you know fran has been gigging the Prelude for over a year now...
http://www.rolandus.com/products/productdetails.php?ProductId=985&ParentId=72
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUTHs-Ls5J0



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 10-24-2010).]

Hey Donny, I knew in the back of my mind that Fran has offered great comments, but wasn't sure he gigged with it too? Great, looking forward to his comments

I know about viewing these links, but under 'fire' in live situations is what I'm interested in. I think the styles alone would offer some variation to my act.

[This message has been edited by zuki (edited 10-23-2010).]

every weekend & beyond.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USGN-KwgTiY&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwn6QiJHoDw&feature=related




[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 10-23-2010).]

Prelude Style demo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDRVWrwDl5A&feature=related

What do you think about it Donny? Please offer you pros and cons

[This message has been edited by zuki (edited 10-23-2010).]

I will let Fran chime in as he is more of an expert as he uses it nightly....
honestly I have only played it in his studio once.

Missing from the Prelude that would greatly increase it's value for me....76 keys like on the Juno Stage (semi weighted)..and "Scat" voices that are missing from the Prelude..

The Prelude has a method of getting around that needs a player getting use to...but once you get it ..it works fine..You can search for styles, tones or even Performances while a song is being used (Style)...

You can also search songs while one is playing (SMF, Wave, MP3)..

Playlist work like a charm..the total amount of media from a USB drive is 999 songs...I like that any type of media resides in a playlist ..unlike the Korg and Yamaha boards..

In addition to the 999 songs on thumb drives..the Prelude memory stores 200 sequences with lyrics..and 100 user styles...There are also 128 user performances..

As I have mentioned before the Prelude is excellent in my band use and for the nursing type gigs too...

With the band all our stuff is readily available to perform at a touch of a button..
Solo gigs, with the large selection of styles (presets and user)..and 200 SMF's with lyrics..the Prelude is more than capable..


I really do miss the Scat and 76 keys though..

BTW: SMF's sound great..and the real-time voices do not effect the SMF voices ..and vice versa..unlike the Juno series G and Stage)..

The great lyric read and edit tools as well as many other features comes with the version 2 update (No need to buy another keyboard..just add the free updates)..

You might want to re-assess that one Fran. The Korg DOES allow any sort of media to be used in its songbook, and subsequent playlists. Along with EVERY setting on the keyboard, including vocalist, ALL ots settings ALL pedal and controller settings etc etc. Adn all at the touch of one Songbook entry.
AND all Songbook entries can be selected via MIDI form an external source (laptop eg) not 144, then you have to change sets.

If you have 1000 songs in the songlist then every one of them can be selected at any time via this method.

The Korg songbook really has NO peer at all. The Roland Im afraid does not come close.

But the Rolands do have other benefits

Dennis

Dennis, I am not sure I have to re-think this issue..

I said reading from a thumb drive ..the media files....not "songbook" where it has to be set up completely to use...I believe that SMF's are in separate folders as are the MP3's....Am I correct? Where the Prelude reads all the formats from the thumb drive...I have not had hands on with the Korg and the use of the MP3 player option card...but I recall reading about it somewhat...

BTW: I know you cannot edit SMF's and save them in Songbook...It will revert back to the original...The Prelude saves any and all changes to the playlist (name for folder) automatically ...

I know the Songbook is popular, but if I recall the E80 with the MP3 option could save all to a user program..so it is on par with the Korg (with MP3 card)..

I don't know of any Yamaha or Korg (under $1,000) that will do what the Prelude does with media files...Does anyone else?

Comparing 3 or 4 times the cost to sorta match the media player of the Prelude...sure seems like an endorsement..

Makes you wonder, though, what someone expects from an arranger under half the price of the PA800...?

Personally, I thought the modern styles on the GW-8 (which has much in common with the Prelude) were very good, but that much of the basics needed tweaking... Not that's it's that hard on a Prelude (probably still easier than most, despite not having the G/E series' touch screen), but still necessary, IMO.

But if you want a lot of rock and dance styles, I think the Prelude/GW-8, especially at THAT price, is pretty good.

Nope they can all (MP3, MIDI, Text file, whatever) be in the same big folder if you like. I personally had them in different folders as that was my preference.

You said you liked any sort of media being in the playlist...I just said that the Korg does allow this too. You said it didn't. As for the Yammie I don't know so I did not comment on it.

That was a misunderstanding of your comment on my part, so sorry about that one. The way you wrote it was a little confusing.

And the E80 is NOT on par with the Korg in my view, as on the E80 you are still restricted to a max of 144 recallable via midi UPG setups, WITHOUT having to load up a new UPS.

As for edited MIDIS, the beauty of the Korg Songbook is, it is a pointer to the data..So all it does is recall whatever file you are using where-ever it is stored. So if the MIDI is edited then the Songbook recalls the edited midi file..

As for the under $1000 , I can only agree with that

Dennis

All Korg has to do is change their folder managment and do away with having to always load by SETS etc .....which is so annoying...

Yes Donny, true. The loading of additional styles via the style and set folder management was always clunky. The PA2 and OS 3.01 alleviated it a LITTLE bit, but Korg could really learn from Roland and Yamaha in this regard.

Dennis

Dennis being a big Korg KB fan for many many years form their beginning arrangers thru the M1/T1,2,3,...PA series to present Ive performed with them all....I really enjoyed them for many reasons....I had hoped they would change the folder system with the PA800 & PA2x but to no avail it remains the antiquated management system to this day...just try to audition a Korg style in EMC or load just the style into the keyboard....it's a tedious amount of steps and when you want to try 20/30 styles it becomes a pain in the butt loading/deleting, user slot assignments.
I hope they can change this process.....
now that the Tyros 4 is released and I know what to expect form the next trickle down S series MOTL unit S920 (?)....I am really looking forward to KORGS next release, as of now my pennies are saving up with nowhere to go ! ...



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 10-24-2010).]

Dennis, there is no 144 user program limit, using the external media and the user program finder..I have 1133 user programs on my G70 ..always available...You just need to use the finder feature..and it also scrolls quickly for the right user program..

Fran what I am talking about is selecting them via a MIDI CC (page 39 i think in the par manual)....You can only select a max of 144.

I know I can select any number from the finder

But with my Music Reader program I can embed MIDI files in the chart and it auto sends the CC command which loads the UPG. Unfortunately on the G70 this IS restricted to 144 per UPS. And the UPS cannot be selected via MIDI

On the Korg I had, at last count, 475 such songs setup. All I did was select a chart and the entire Korg keyboard was setup in a second

Dennis

I think Dennis mentioned this, but you can indeed edit SMF and save them to songbook. You have to edit through seq mode first and save. However, they can be put in a specific 'list' but have to be accessed via the song mode, vs the style mode. A little bit of an inconvenience, not much.

Man, how sweet it might be to have my 800 and a Prelude - best of 2 worlds, while keeping down costs. I want to get my hands on these Prelude styles while accessing my huge library of Roland styles. I might be contacting you Fran for some guidance....

But its okay, I have found that all it takes is a little bit more pre-planning and I am finding I can work with the 144 limit.

I find the other playing characteristics of the G70 far outweigh this one small issue

As I said to Diki recently, I had forgotten how good the G70 was to actually PLAY!!!

Dennis

But to add to this Zuki, when accessed from the Songbook, the Korg automatically puts the keyboard into the correct mode without any player intervention.

I do know that on the Prelude you cannot play an MP3 AND a style/midi at the same time, so there is no real difference there.

But on the G70 it IS possible to use a style and a midi file on the same song

The UPG system is also very useful if you want to have different beats for the same song. Green Dolphin street for example.

On mine I have one UPG set for the latin, and then below it I have the swing. Selecting is easy and so quick there is no discernible timing change at all. It just smoothly flows. Cool feature I reckon

Dennis

Zuki heres a Tip go play the Prelude somewhere before you make a purchase.... ....so now are you gonna carry two KBs to NH gigs?



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 10-24-2010).]

A good suggestion, Donny. I played the GW-8 and it was underwhelming...not bad, mind you, just not impressive.

Ian

There is no way a first time player of a Prelude can learn enough to understand what a great keyboard it is.....No 1 or 2 hour demo is going to work...If you are a Roland user..it still will need time to get a handle of the Prelude..Once you know the instrument..it is hard to not use it..even with 61 keys...

How good is it...I am seriously thinking of using the G70 and Prelude together..

Jim you can carry a PA800 and a 17 pound Prelude (under one arm)..

You have to spend time with it to understand it..I seen Donny struggle to try and figure it out..even thought it is simple to use....Patience is a virtue..

Yes Fran I totally agree. The GW8/Prelude are not as easy as you would think. Once familiar they are pretty straightforward. So I too would recommend Zuki take one home for a day or so.

Dennis

Dennis quote.."But on the G70 it IS possible to use a style and a midi file on the same song"


Dennis, can you explain how you are doing this?

Dennis quote.."But on the G70 it IS possible to use a style and a midi file on the same song"


Dennis, can you explain how you are doing this?

Are you just referring to a User Program containing both or using them together..

as far as I know you can only do this simultaneously on the Ketron Midjay/Audya.....& possibly the mediastation..

I can't but Diki can...here is the link to his article on how to do it at the Roland forum.. http://roland-arranger.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=97&Itemid=56

I have not had time yet to test it out, but it IS coming from a very experienced G70 source

Dennis

. double


[This message has been edited by miden (edited 10-26-2010).]

Original by Donny [/QUOTE]as far as I know you can only do this simultaneously on the Ketron Midjay/Audya.....& possibly the mediastation..[/B][/QUOTE]

It can sorta kinda be done on the MS, as all outputs are live, but requires a LOT of view jumping to be able to control both, so in real-world terms you would have to say no.

The only products I have used that do this easily are the Ketrons. Pity they do not have many other redeeming features

Dennis


[This message has been edited by miden (edited 10-26-2010).]

as far as I know you can only do this simultaneously on the Ketron Midjay/Audya.....& possibly the mediastation..[/QUOTE]

It can sorta kinda be done on the MS, as all outputs are live, but requires a LOT of view jumping to be able to control both, so in real-world terms you would have to say no.

The only products I have used that do this easily are the Ketrons. Pity they do not have many other redeeming features

Dennis


[This message has been edited by miden (edited 10-26-2010).][/B][/QUOTE]

Simultaneous modes should be standard on all keyboards.....as should many other features...but to no avail keep the public wanting is how they make money.

I 100% agree Donny...It is easily achieved.

Dennis

I would even go so far to say if any manufacturer did a FULL combination of their workstations AND TOTL arrangers, that would be end of the line for all the others, unless they matched it

"Give them just enough where they need me but they dont hate me. ...
and make them keep coming back for more "

Trouble is, a newcomer can come in and DESTROY the competition, if he's willing to do it right. While established companies dole out the technology in reluctant dribs and drabs, eking us along like crack addicts, a new company can start up with everything in one go, and all the established manufacturers are scrambling to play catch-up.

That's what Lionstracs SHOULD have done... Bundle TOTL styles, based around a TOTL sound set, make operating the MS easy (hide all the tough stuff in sub-menus) and price it the same as a Tyros. But NOOOOooooo....! They got to come out with something that SUCKS until you fill it with premium content. But there IS no premium content. So it sucks!

So near, and yet so far. Dom has NO IDEA how close he came, and dropped the ball. Who in their right minds would buy a closed arranger, if an open one sounded JUST AS GOOD? The day that happens, sayonara, Yamaha! Hasta la vista, Ketron... So long, Korg!

We sure as hell won't miss your miserly feature improvements, every three or four years!

C'mon.... SOMEBODY get it right!

You just can\t anyone credit eh?....as if they care what YOU think...Domenic has done a fine job so far with the Mediastation & as an open "work in progress" it continues to get better little by little. You can make the MS do anything you desire..not everyone needs it to be an "arranger" as it surly can be..it's much more then that. have you ever played one?....
I have a few times.

as far as I know you can only do this simultaneously on the Ketron Midjay/Audya.....& possibly the mediastation..[/QUOTE]

It can sorta kinda be done on the MS, as all outputs are live, but requires a LOT of view jumping to be able to control both, so in real-world terms you would have to say no.

The only products I have used that do this easily are the Ketrons. Pity they do not have many other redeeming features

Dennis


[This message has been edited by miden (edited 10-26-2010).][/B][/QUOTE]

Actually..only Yamaha does this effectively...I don't want to mix an MP3 or a SMF..or style ..I want to replace the drum of a sequence and use the arranger drum in it's place....This is what Yamaha can do.....I don't need to mix all of them..I want a simple replace one part of a seq with a part from a style and use the style in real time..

Someone who has had the MIdjay for longer may be able to confirm, but I am pretty sure thats the sort of thing you could do. I don't think it was available on the SD1 series though. Only those products that had MP3/Audio playback...

Might bear some further investigation if thats what you want to be able to do

Aj had demonstrated the DRUM REMIX feature in the Audya 5 to do exactly what your asking.

Donny I am not asking, Fran is
I was just passing on the small knowledge I remember about the Midjay

This all stemmed from me making the comment about using SMF's and styles together on the G70 as outlined by Diki at the Roland forum.

NOT that I wanted to do it, or indeed do I have any interest whatsoever, nor any need, for a "Drum Remix" option...

Dennis I also believe if I remember correctly My Midjay also had the Drum Remix feature as long as it's a compatible BPM range style to match up with the SMf when you mute the drum track on track 10.

And utterly failed to be even the slightest bit enthusiastic about it as an arranger. You SURE didn't rush out to buy one, did you?

Look, how about acknowledging what the post was about? If Dom had made the MS sound as good as a PA2Xpro or T4 or Audya (or even a bloody G70 ) OOTB, the line would have gone around the block, the city and the world! But he didn't. He left it to his customers to do what every other arranger company trusts to VERY talented and experienced people. And the end result is, NOBODY got it to sound good as an arranger.

Because, to be honest, if you are THAT talented and experienced, you aren't making a living playing arrangers! You make styles FOR MONEY. You make soundsets FOR MONEY. But you don't do it as a personal exercise.

Even you, Donny... (look how you can't even find it in you to edit the T4 styles for your S910. Now imagine that, for an ENTIRE style set )

Dom has a small window. He can either get it RIGHT now, or someone with a better style team and voicing team is going to make one that WORKS, just like an S910, and then no-one will remember that Dom had first crack at it. People tend to remember the winners, NOT the losers in any technology race. Arranger players OVERWHELMINGLY want a well voiced and styled arranger OOTB. After that, all the open stuff is great. But we have seen just exactly how popular the MS is.

Dom's doing a great job.... yeah, right!

If you bought one and it sounded as good as an Audya, or a T4, THEN he'd be doing a great job! And I'd have one, and so would you, and so would just about EVERYBODY here that could afford it.

Until then...