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#31691 - 04/26/06 06:32 PM Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Lucky2Bhere Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/06
Posts: 533
I got turned on to Ketron arrangers through someone on this site and I've researched as much as I could about the products. Went to see and play the SD5 and SD1 today and was knocked out by the inherent dynamics in this keyboard and the excitement it brought out in me. I found myself absolutely motivated to play and with new ideas pouring out of me with each dance style and instrument patch. This was after playing the G-70, PA1X, and Tyros2 in another store for many hours. In all fairness, I like the navigation system and all the bells and whistles on the G-70 which I don't think I'm going to find on the Ketron products. Nevertheless, unless the Roland E-80 changes my mind, it appears I'm going to go with a Ketron. Best sounds I've ever heard.


Unfortunately, I don't have easy access to these instruments as most of you know the stores don't stock them.

Can all of you who are familiar with any Ketron product advise me what you're doing with YOUR units and what keyboard (or Midjay) would you advise me to focus on? And....what features do you like best that are unique to Ketron and what's missing compared to the others? Do all the models sound pretty much the same? Any advice or comments at all that you have is welcome? There has to be a catch somewhere. This keyboard sounds toooooo perfect!

Thanking you in advance for leaving your posts below.


[This message has been edited by Lucky2Bhere (edited 04-27-2006).]

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#31692 - 04/27/06 03:57 AM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Craig_UK Offline
Member

Registered: 11/23/04
Posts: 914
Loc: UK
If you are wanting to move between styles and sounds quickly I find that the SD1 is no way near as quick as my Tyros 2.
Also the way it operates is behind the times, far too many button presses for my liking and the display screen looks like it came out of Noah's Ark compared to the larger colour screens on other models.
I do like the sounds and styles, no way near as good as the Tyros 2 mind in my opinion, but I'm selling mine as it's far too slow for my liking when playing live.
Good luck with what you get but I should wait for the new Roland E80 and then take the best you can afford.

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#31693 - 04/27/06 06:03 PM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Lucky2Bhere Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/06
Posts: 533
Craig....thanks. I wasn't aware of those facts. I'm kind of curious also to see what the E-80 will have to offer. Speed on stage is of the essence to me, I need almost istant access to the sounds, particularly, obviously, fast numbers. Does it slow you down that much?

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#31694 - 04/29/06 07:35 AM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Ketron_AJ Offline
Moderator

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 3600
Loc: Middletown, DE
Just to add some words, when we mention speed of accessing sounds and styles, what exactly are we refering to?

Most high-end arrangers today operate on the following idea.

* Voice group buttons - push one e.g. Piano and the screen displays a bunch of individual pianos. Push one of the buttons on the side to select/activate that voice of choise OR move to page 2, 3 ... and select.

* Style group buttons - push one e.g. Latin and the screen displays a bunch of individual styles within the selected group. Push one of the buttons on the side to select/activate that style of choise OR move to page 2, 3 ... and select.

** Registration/Pannel Memory/Pannel Settings (One Touch/Touch to Style ...etc). These are all various ways to store and instantly retrieve keyboard settings for live performance. Ofcourse the storing is done at home and the retreival on stage/live. Terminology depends on what keyboard you get!

The questions is, once accessed how fast/slow does it load up/ready for use? From one manufacturer to another, pretty much the same.

Thanks,

AJ

PS: Now some manufacturers have some tools used to better access styles for certain songs based on what THEY think is best - ofcourse these settings can be edited (e.g. Music Finder). Pretty cool!
_________________________
[KETRON - USA]
Design Engineer & Product Specialist.
www.KetronAmerica.com

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#31695 - 04/30/06 10:39 PM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Lucky2Bhere Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/06
Posts: 533
AJ...I DID play the SD1 and found it to be fast enough to navigate the instrument patches readily (I'm assuming it's as easy to pull up a dance style). The posting above from Craig caused me to question that. As far as I remember, I found no difficulty in that respect.

I should add, my needs are unique. I have all music in my head (spent many years memorizing). I will think nothing of playing a 15 minute medley and weaving through different sounds and styles and types of songs. This is why fast "navigation" of a keyboard is essential, though not my only need. I tend to show off a keyboard's capabilities (to an audience) as well as entertain them with good music. No response needed as I'm still pouring through Ketron brochures and reading comments on the Web from Ketron users/players. So far I am hearing nothing but praise about Ketron and am looking forward to owning one ASAP.

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#31696 - 05/01/06 02:21 PM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Ketron_AJ Offline
Moderator

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 3600
Loc: Middletown, DE
_________________________
[KETRON - USA]
Design Engineer & Product Specialist.
www.KetronAmerica.com

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#31697 - 05/02/06 09:45 AM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Alex K Offline
Member

Registered: 12/03/99
Posts: 732
Loc: Phoenix, AZ USA
Lucky,

I remember that Ketron used to have a neat one-touch facility for selecting sounds: when you press the One Touch button, the screen used to show 24 instrument sounds, any of which could be accessed with a single button press. You can pre-select them ahead of time. I believe there was also a second page of OneTouch sounds, for a total of 48, though to get to the second page, you needed to press another button (so the second page should have been called Two Touch ). Still, this is a pretty neat system. I wonder if the newer boards (SD1, SD5) retain this capability. It would also be cool to be able to select sound programs (in Ketron parlance this is split/layer combinations of up to 4 right hand tones) in the same way.

Yamaha, Korg, and the new Rolands have 4 one-touch buttons, which you can pre-program with sounds for each style (in Roland - don't know about others). This works well too, if you can limit your selection of instruments to 4. In Roland G70, it seems to only work for the built-in styles, and not for the styles on the memory card. Don't know about the others.

I sometimes play in the same mode as you do, having a large repertoire in my head, but not programmed into the instrument. While I can have several songs in a row use the same (or similar) accompaniment style, I like to be able to change the melody voices on the fly. Most instruments require that you select a tone category, and then after paging through the tones in the category and locating the tone you want, you make the individual selection. In most instruments this requires pressing a button on the right end of the instrument (to select the tone bank), and then to refocus and more your attention to the screen, to use paging and selection buttons on either side of the screen to pick out the individual tone. To make things worse, many instruments have loads of tones (Roland boasts over 3000), so I am often afraid to start messing around with selecting tones on the fly during performance.

I think a better system would be to allow selection of a default tone (or several default tones) in each category, e.g. if I select Piano category, a bright piano would be selected, until I pick a different variation (e.g. grand, european PF, etc.). My argument is that while it may be preferrable to be using a Grand sample, it is better to use the default piano tone than getting lost wading through the pages looking for the best tone when you need to make a change quickly. These default tones should be user-configurable. I would even say that the first page should contain default tones, and pressing on the tone bank selection button should cycle through them, except the last selection, which should be "Show full list", that would bring up the regular pages. This way I could set it up to press Piano bank once for Bright Piano, press Piano bank twice for Electric piano, or press Brass bank button once for trumpet, twice for trombone, etc.

There are only so many instruments that a conductor/arranger can select from in real world. Since most of us play music that used to be accompanied by real instruments, I think this approach can be extremely useful in helping users quickly change between sounds of a limited but realistic sound set.


Ideally, these default tone selections could be saved with performance memories, so that when I play, say, Jazz, the default guitar sound would be acoustic, but when a Rock style is being played, the default guitar is, say, overdrive. Nonetheless, I would be happy if an instrument had even a static list of the default tones accessible in this fashion.

At the present time, as far as I know, none of the manufactures are providing such a function; however, it would be a relatively simple software change to implement such functionality.

I hope AJ will make a note of this while contemplating the next round of enhancements of Ketron instruments.

Regards,
Alex
_________________________
Regards,
Alex

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#31698 - 05/02/06 10:43 PM Re: Professional musician asks: Can you help me with information about Ketron arrangers?
Lucky2Bhere Offline
Member

Registered: 03/04/06
Posts: 533
Alex...this was a great letter that you wrote...very detailed and tuned to my style of music. Between you and AJ, I'm becoming slowly indoctrinated to the Ketron world.

I spoke to AJ today, and we both decided that it would be a good idea for me to read the manual which I had downloaded so I understand all these Ketron terms better. I understood most of what you were saying, and made mental notes of some procedures that I want to look up in the manual. My progress with this instrument is coming along very slowly, but at least it's coming along.

Since you seem to play the way I do, if you feel there's anything about the SD1 that is difficult to work with would you please do another posting?

Otherwise, so far I have never seen a more perfect keyboard for entertaining. The only thing missing is the pretty Roland G-70 colors.

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