Nick,

I think all the Yamaha demo guys are great, Gyn Madden did Yamaha demos not certain what he is doing now, he was a nice guy. My real complaint is the other KB manufactures don't appear to think it is important to demo, they do it on the fly, not fully organised , unless someone can find some and post, the one the James post they guy on the drum was hellish good, but would we play like that, not in a 1,000,000 years, my wife plays hell at what I play now, if I started banging the drums hell!

Tony

Tony

AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello everyone,
I am a happy T4 owner and also of other brand arrangers, you need to know what is been played by a sequence and play over it....the demo on the video with the Clavinova and the T2, is a sequence/Midi file/SMF that both musicians rehearsed, it IS NOT an style played by either arranger/player. Check the precise fills/breaks there is NO such style in either board, or even in the newest T4. See how Peter can lift the left hand and there are chord changes, instrumentation added without pushing any buttons...

I am surprise that no one had catched that, I have seen in a life performance how Peter can demo any keyboard using just the internal styles or even with just one plain piano sound and he is amazing!!

This is an observation that I also made when other brands introduced other arrangers,and those demos where actually a sequence very "showy" but in the actual arranger, IF only where used with the internal styles, that demo could NOT happen with styles along, I posted this topic LONG time ago.

You have to be able to know what is a style or play over a sequence well made.

I love my arrangers and have nothing but respect for Peter and most of the professional demonstrators, most are very talented.

Wow, upon further review, I do believe you are correct mdorantes.
It's tough to know anymore, especially for the average viewer/listener.

For me, it puts a slight damper on the video, knowing it's not 100% live playing. However, I'm not so sure if we want to go down that "midi/style recording" road argument AGAIN, especially since it seems that 'format' is used quite often by Pro's in public.

...Oops, I think I just went down that 'road'...I'm turning back home.

Anyway good observation mdorantes

Larry.

I don't care if I could play 10% as good I would be very happy I don't care what addins are being used, it sounds bloody good to me.
All I said was I have not seen anyone as good on SZ, if anyone has then post it.

Tony

I did demo for several manufacturers including the Yamaha electones, Hammond organs and Lowrey,(remember those AOAI conventions in the 80's in USA?) said that, you need to have playing skills and showcase the instrument you are demoing, there are basically 2 types of demos, one that show to the users/customers/salespeople, what is available in the instrument, styles/features can sound like, the other, is to "show-off" not just your skills, but the instrument as well. One of the masters is Hector Olivera(now with Roland Ataliers) that did demo for Yamaha the HX1, also made a software company with a very young talented Craig Knudsen, they made sounds, registrations, etc, and the "Freeze" floppy for the MDRs that where used on the Electones at the time.

And as far it goes, in the Clavinova/T2 video demo, using a SMF, as well a style (In a way a style is many midi files that loop in a controlled/manipulated way), it is consider Real time, because it is happening in that precise moment.

Like I said, I have used and still use similar "stuff" to demo/perform, I prefer use styles, actually, User styles/song-styles, etc...
That way you sound like that(showy), without the limitation that the SMF has, the duration, this way I can make it 2 minutes long or IF I wish, 15 minutes long, wherever I feel like.

I have nothing against using SMF, I use the ones I make myself, there are partial, meaning, it does not have ALL the parts, I purposely left the parts I play live along with it.

I loved it...and I think playing with MIDI files is underrated for complex pieces.
After all you can only do so musch with style play and a fixed function style.
A multi-sequecnced MIDI opens up the world to you.
Remember we don'y all play out in front of growds where we would need to be 'flexible' on our playing...
A Orchestra performance is usually played 'byu the book'
I plan to use a lot of MIDI when I get my new arranger.

This is an Arranger KB forum. Almost by definition it's going to be populated by people who are going to be more accepting of, or even desirous of, any device that will enhance their performance (or what they CALL 'their' performance). If a talented, classically trained pianist walks into a room with a TOTL arranger KB and a concert Grand piano and wants to impress you, he is likely to go to the piano (even in the unlikely event that he is thoroughly familiar with the Arranger KB). Likewise, a talented vocalist is more likely to look upon a pitch-correction device with a little more disdain than their less talented brethren. In both cases, they are likely to view these devices as 'crutches', rather than performance-enhancing devices. Whether it's true or not is always going to be up to the perception of the individual. One man's truth............etc., etc. Although I don't (and wouldn't) use midi 'live' on a gig, I think it is a perfectly acceptable tool to use any way one chooses. I just think it should be made from scratch by the end-user (with the possible exception of the drum track--not everyone can master drum tracks). Of course not everyone (even GREAT keyboardist) can create an authentic sounding bass or string or guitar track either, so there could be some justification for (partially) using commercially prepared tracks. However, what is acceptable to me shouldn't amount to a hill of beans to anyone else. All of these things are used by a variety of people for a variety of reasons, and those reasons only need be valid for the person using them.

I tend to think pretty much like Larry. Admiring a performance that has been professionally sequenced and excellently played over, says more about the performer than about the keyboard, as probably both the sequenced parts AND the voices used by the demonstrator, could both probably be reproduced with even software. To buy an instrument based solely on this type of demo (although it's designed to sell the instrument) seems monumentally uh, dumb to me. But that's just my opinion, and ONLY an opinion. I guess I just never really understood how someone could get gratification from presenting something that's not you, as you. But hey, to each his own.

chas

Hi Guys,
Just a clarification.
The video with Peter was not a demo.
Every year the German Yamaha KB forum gets together for a weekend keyboard forum jam and workshops.
Yamaha is always invited.
The video was done by one of the attendees.
The sequence that you here was programmed by Peter himself and it was understood at the jam that he only played the piano part to a sequence he played and programmed himself...
With that said; it's still quite impressive.
Many other forum members play and get to jam.
There are many more YouTube videos from the jam too.
Eric

I feel much the same way, and prefer to use styles, mainly because of the flexibility compared to SMF...I find it gives me more control over an arrangement. Plus, you have the option of switching variations when you want them to switch, not at a predetermined point...and, you can actually switch to another style altogether.

The story behind this video is simple...Peter is a fantastic piano player, and the Clavinova CVP is a terrific 88 note weighted action piano. What better way to demo the piano sound than over a midi file of his own making, where he can use his pianistic skills to full effect i.e. using both hands?

When you see Peter demonstrate the Tyros4, he uses styles, as the instrument is predominantly an arranger...the CVP is first and foremost a digital piano with arranger features.

When I had a P-85 here, I made my own midi files on the S910, and played the piano along with them, to keep my chops in shape.

However, when playing "live" with Tyros4 I always use styles, mostly of my own making (using Style Assembly). I just prefer that way...it isn't the same for all of us.

Ian