How does one actually find a "female" vocalist to work with? I went to a park concert last week where the artist had 3 of them in his show. Fran has the only other 2 left on the planet it seems.

I've been trying for years to find one. Put ads in the paper, called singing teachers, asked around, etc.

But the qualifier is someone "good!"...a trained voice, and a decent personality and an eagerness to work at performing. A combination like that you would only find in Ripley's Believe It or Not, it seems.

I've just about given up on the idea by now, but I still wouldn't turn it away if it showed up on my doorstep.

Any thoughts, anyone? Or should I ask Fran if I could "rent" his?

Mark

Hells Mark where you been all these years, Fran's dollys don't sing, like Fran don't play, they are only for show... ask the man in the moon... more chance of a straight answer... thats why Fran can't afford and Audya, Korg pa3x, high costs of Dollys, don't you go down that route, The Road to Perdition. anyway if you do take on staff for your business make sure you have the contract in your hand, signed..

They're a great addition and selling point but just always seem to have some sort of problems. The gigs too far, my boyfriend/fiance/ex/husband, I'm tired from work, my voice isn't right tonight, etc. etc.

I've done duos and trios with four different ones and it was always something. I did all the booking, brought and set up all the equipment including her mic, picked and learned the songs. Couldn't of made it easier for them. One I had could NEVER be on time . We worked a restaurant around the corner from her house and she was 1/2 hr. late the first night!! Did a Wedding and here she comes walking up the side of the room as I'm announcing the Bridal Party !! Her boyfriend was a full time musician with two wedding bands and a big band. She wouldn't work with him because he worked too much. I asked for his advice and he said "fine her for every minute she's late" HA!
Be careful and good luck.

Go see duos etc with girl singers....ask them if they have any friends who are looking for work to sing usually they know other singers......as Bill said I'd recommend playing alone also if you can sing, less aggravation and more money for you.......no need for more headaches and I find that girl singers after a while all sound the same due to their pitch range VS a male voice....that's why many wedding bands have two singers to cover more songs..

Same here! I have NEVER had a good working relationship with a female singer or band member.

Boyfriend problems...money problems...."no shows"...being unhappy with the sound system, material, number of songs she sang or stage....the list goes on and on.

Tried a duo with a female for several years,. Went through 8.


NEVER AGAIN!


Russ

As to finding a female singer: I found my last one by going to Karaoke venues and keeping and eye and ear out for one who would like to join me and who
would bring added value to what I was doing. We had at least 6 productive years as a duo with strong bookings....until the "recession".

As for working with female singers:
My last 4+ group was in the early 80's and each group had at least one female singer.. For the next 15 yrs I worked as a duo with a 3 different female singers.
I'm not saying there wasn't a problem here or there, but, for the most part it worked in both our favors. I was able to charge enough to cover their pay and
sometimes more.

We got clients who would otherwise not have wanted a single. The variety of lead voices was a plus and kept the show from getting too much of the same ol'
same ol'. And the background harmonies we provided each other were a real plus over digital harmonizers.

The only major downside to performing with others for me has been the scheduling of rehearsals...especially when the other person(s) live out of town. A big plus,
however, is having a singer to rely on when the other one is sick or otherwise can't sing.

That was then. Along came the "recession" and it seemed all the clients wanted to negotiate the fee down. I had no choice but to book myself as a single
if I couldn't get the duo's fee. Now, my last singer has retired and I have been performing 100% single for several years. I won't be seeking another partner.
It takes more effort and time trying to find the right one, get the act together and book it. But, I do miss having that re-enforcement and additional talent on stage.

Eddie

Mark, do what I did, marry the canary.

Always on time, leaves the house same time as me.
Both paycheques come in the same door.
100% time to mull over/critique new material or the night's gig.
No sweat arranging practice time.
Wifey even makes the coffee.

Never been a problem for me (and if it were, would I admit it on here, anyway)

Okay guys....listen up....Listen to the guy that has hired and worked with the most talented , attractive , girls in the business..

I will tell you the How, why , and when of the subject..


First off, don't listen to any of the above guys that rather work by themselves....they have not experienced what I have

There are talented "young " ladies that want to break into the business...all over the place..

You have to open your mouth and ask!!!..If there is someone that could be a good prospective partner on stage...Speak up...

I have found great "potential" singers that turned into "stars"

And the fun of auditioning prospects...is easily better than watch American Idol on TV

For the most part, I have found young ladies that wanted to work with "me"....via friends in the business...people like Uncle Dave (who chooses to work by himself)....

I have broke in Bar tenders, and waitresses, that worked in the clubs I played....

I worked with "girl singers" for nearly 30 years, and by far, my most enjoyable on stage memories are with these girls...

Look for earnest, girls, that are excited about working with you...I use to have so many "new girls" asking about "How to get started"..when I worked with the Michaels (Mychaels) girls...They were great together, and draw-ed so much attention, that other girls envied what they did....This was a time I gave the bartender "Denise" a chance to work with me..side by side with Andrea Mychaels and Debra Mychaels.....she went on to be successful with many other bands...

Don't be afraid to set some standards ..even if they seam superficial..."Looks" is as important on stage as the vocal ability.....don't dismiss this as chauvinistic...How many homely girls do you know that are successful as singers on stage.....?....neither do I..

Talent can be taught and improved...most of the time..it is just inexperience...."Looks" are hard to develop when it comes to stage presence..

Ask yourself "why" you want to work with a "girl"....Are you interested in improving your song material, adding female songs? Are you trying to improve your stage image?, Are you trying to improve your demand in the business"..Are you looking to have more "fun" on stage? Are you interested in developing an interaction on stage..that is infectious to the audience..

All of these are the benefits you can have with the "right" partner...

Over the years I have had the cutest, most talented young ladies (dozens)..they can be found, just open your eyes, and don't be afraid to reach for the moon....Ask the pretty girl sitting in your audience, if she "sings"...you may just find a gem...I have....over and over..

On the "don't" list.....stay away from those ..you just want to hook up with...Stay away from those that already have baggage...drink to much, drugs, evident active sex life...hanging with low lifes...you get what I mean...

If there is a husband or boyfriend...make sure there is not a jealousy issue...both the "girl" and your own spouse...Flirting and interaction on stage is a "must"...you are in the "show" business...and if you want to build your following...this will aid the results..largely..

Remember you are sharing the stage, whoever you work with ...be honest with them...don't play money games etc with them...Be up front with the money they will receive....You can and should continue to make the decisions on the business end...but don't forget to consult your stage partner...

One of the most important things in this business..."Don't burn your bridges"...and that goes for the people you share stages with.....Great re-pore with the people you have surround you...will be a lasting virtue...

Hells Fran,

You're a man of the World and a half, Mr Teflon, slippery as grease lightening or a jar of eels. No flies on Fran

I would write if book if you have time Fran, I will do the Title if you do the filly in bits in the middle.

Tony

Here is one for starter Fran "OUT OF THE FRYING PAN AND INTO THE FIRE"

So Fran in other words.....STAY SOLO..

Donny,

How did you see through all that claptrap


Tony

lets just say I know what I'm talking about, I had a girl & a guy lead singers in my 7pc band for 20+ years ......I also had a duo with a girl for years also KB/Guitar......now I was lucky and had minimal group problems,......but last 17 years as a Power Single and I wouldn't trade it for the world..as I said if you can't sing lead all night then get someone to do it girl or guy....but, be prepared for all the consequences, financially and personally....have fun.

Like Fran, I have worked with several female vocalists over the years, both in band situations and as a duo. He makes some good points.

Fortunately, I've never had any issues as the relationships were based on mutual respect, and the desire to make the other, or others, sound good.

It has to be teamwork, and professional stage presentation and interaction is extremely important as many people "hear with their eyes"...not to mention the music should be well prepared and suitable for a female vocalist.

It also depends on the quality of the venues you play. Choose wisely.

Ian

Donny ... what is a "POWER" SINGLE ... as opposed to - lets say - a NON POWER SINGLE ???
inquiring minds NEED to know ...
thnx

"Oh Lord, it's hard to be humble".....Mac Davis


chas

Chas known in the business a power single is someone who sounds like a full band with vocals and can cover a danc floor also vs let's say a single piano player doing background music ....

This is what I'd call a real "POWER SINGLE"...met this guy many years ago when he performed at a local bar...no styles, no Karaoke singing over SMF or MP3...just great talent and clever use of technology.

He puts on quite a show...the lights are triggered by the drum foot switches and chest pads...he "sings" the electric guitar solos.

"Power single " is often misused and misunderstood term when it comes to music entertaining...


A real "power single" is a player that has command of his/her audience as a dominant player/performer....the "power single" will maintain a "Dance" floor, with "big" sound...with or without vocals.....They are not a lay backed performer....

I know many performers that claim this title....but they are not a true "power single"....In fact I only know of one or two single acts that qualify....

The real power single will not rely on MP3 tracks, but will use sequence backing that they manipulate in real time....If you ever see a "power single" you will know it..

Ian's video clip is a good example of a power single, not because of the gimmicky way he does it...but the way he does it, and his demand attention from the audience...


I hope I explained...without insulting the folks that thought they were "power singles"..

For sure...I am not..I can pretend to be for short performances


Don't get "power single" confused with "Solo" entertainer...there is big difference..

I think this guy, McRorie, is so much my definition of a "Power Single", simply because he is playing all the parts himself, "live"...bass Left Hand, Rhythm chords Right Hand, Lead vocals and Lead Guitar via voice and mic, and drums by footwork and hands. There is not one part pre-recorded.

If the primary function of the performer is simply singing over a prerecorded background, such as an MP3 or any kind of an SMF, they are hardly a "Power Single" in my opinion, no matter how much the audience is captivated and/or enthralled.

They are, what I would call, a great "entertainer", or "solo entertainer"....some people would even go so far as to call them professional Karaoke performers, depending on how much actual keyboard playing was being done, but, "entertainer" works just fine for me.

Ian

PS...just for the record, I don't consider myself a "Power Single".

Power single -
One person running a show and making a big sound. The tools & techniques vary, but a talented emcee is required and one with a working knowledge of dancing, tempos and room rhythms.
Many of us use multiple sources as backing or supplemental backing, but one thing is consistent - One person running the show and making a big sound with whatever tools he/she chooses.
I proudly use all the tools available to me, including SMF, MP3, CDG, rhythm patterns, arranger trax, manual bass with live chording along with strong vocals and harmonies - BUT - if a prerecorded assistant ever fails ... I can go into "100% live mode" in an instant and make it seem like that was my intent.
I'm sick of the discussions comparing "players" and non "players" based on the degree of automation used - you can't be a purist and play an arranger, just as you can't be a purist and sing in a microphone. These electronic "buddies" are here to enhance, thicken and fill out the sound - use 'em or not .... it's your choice, but if you sit at an arranger .... don't throw stones at the guy who stands behind a computer. You never know how many hoops he's jumping through to make the room happen.
This is my 43rd year making money as a musician, and I've done it in almost every conceivable way with almost every combination of tools/instruments available.
In truth - I probably sounded just as good 25 years ago with no automation but the drum machine, playing Rhodes (right hand) Moog bass (left hand) and jumping up and down between the Rhodes and the "Synth du jour". I played rooms that 5 pc bands played and got the same money - I had bigger crowds than many of the bands. My summer spot at the Jersey shore asks me to work weekends every year, but it's too much with my teaching schedule.
Hi, my name is Uncle Dave, and I'm a power single.

I am hardly a purist, but I just can't see a person who sings over pre-recorded tracks (Karaoke style), and who plays his instrument (guitar, keyboard, whatever) very little, or not at all, as being anything close to a "power single".

To most people, the words "Power Single" conjures up a vision of an exceptionally accomplished solo musician, not just a singer/entertainer who uses tracks.

Using a few tracks to enhance a performance, is understandable...using nothing but tracks, just smacks of Karaoke, in my opinion.

Of course, as we will see, the meaning of the term "Power Single" can be interpreted many ways, and can even be twisted enough to suit any one's present (or past) situation, but, in my opinion, McRorie comes far closer to it than anyone else I've seen or heard on SZ. You may not like the genre he plays, but there's no denying the cracking musical talent and coordination needed to pull off such an impressive solo act.

Ian

I use social media to contact musicians in my area. Myspace is still used widely by bands, although Facebook seems to be more the place for younger musicians and solo artists. Youtube is also very handy and might turn up some local talent.

In many cases you can get an idea of their abilities before making contact.

Dave why explain yourself? ....who cares what the so called purists" think?...I certainly don't..

Yes....Uncle Dave is a "power single"....

When you can turn off the automatic arranger play...and still maintain a dance floor with lots of energy and a big sound...Left hand bass that is kicking, and drum patterns that keep it going...Keeping the music going with a strong full sound (In UD's case strong vocals)...Now you have a "POWER SINGLE"...

No big deal there Fran, we do "ALL" that every gig anyway for years every, Lh bass, no bass, no arranger, DJ,karaoke, Mp3's who freakin cares? it's all good...just make music & make money and survive,......now to see a female "Power Single" in action that's a treat.. let's face it CHANGE is here people, the "old ways" are slowly disappearing like it or not, times change, people change, nobody cares,.....embrace it, drop the ego,jump on the bandwagon, or get left in the dust,.......

David B. was kind enough to share with the group why he feels he is a Power Single.

My name is Ian, and I am neither a Power Single, or a purist.

I am an arranger player.

Glad to be here and glad to be playing.

Certainly, in the topsy-turvy worlds of Karaoke, heavy metal rock, and progressive jazz, playing a superior quality, top of the line, arranger keyboard, like a Yamaha Tyros4 or Korg PA3X in style mode, and then, breaking into your own rendition of that great, but little known, Country Classic, I Kissed Her On The Lips, And I Left Her Behind For You has gotta be one of the most powerful and enriching experiences an arranger player can go through.

Or, there's always blueberry pie and ice cream. (Hear that Tony Hughes?)

Ian

WOW ... I didn't mean to start a global debate - but this being S-Z I should have known - but not being familiar with the term as it is not one I've heard used here in RI and back in the day in NY it was all BANDS that were playing, I really wanted to know what the term referred to ... after reading the responses, IMHO a "Power Single" is anyone who commands the attention and participation of the audience, regardless of what 'tools' they may be using ...
If I don't want a person who plays a solo instrument to mock me for playing an arranger KB, then, as Uncle Dave said. I can't "throw stones at the guy who stands behind a computer" ...
If you are the only person on stage and you have the audience reacting as you want, you are a "Power Single" -
even if you are playing background music in a restaurant and you see the audience reacting to your performance, or as people are leaving they pass by and compliment you on the music !!!
JMHO

I figure as long as I don't have to get up every morning and go do some real work, that's powerful enough for me.
Regarding female singers, I've worked with several and they were mostly a pain in the butt. Had a couple who were really good, but there is always some sort of baggage.
Now, if I find one who will provide the p.a., haul it, set it up, play the music and just let me show up and sing, then give me half the money, and my part of the money is still as much as I make alone, then I'll reconsider.
DonM

Power single is also known in the "business" as a guide reference for AGENTS to categorize your act within their mix vs the other acts they manage.....

Oh the band days early 80's.....

Here is one..Her name is Kristen Coryell..

Girl singer, too. Good to see you were keeping your eyes off her congas, Donny.

Never heard of a power single. Did hear of a power trio. That is a trio where each player is a powerhouse, and the final product is as "full" and entertaining as bigger groups. Each player is good enough to be a feature.

Thing is, if you have to tell everyone how good you are....you're probably NOT!

The exception is UD. He's that good, and I'm surprised that he would take the time to tell us what everyone already knows. I'm a BIG FAN, MP3's, laptops, etc. notwithstanding. I look past all that at the talent.

As an occasional member of an audience I have the right to an opinion, even if some, including some here don't care what that opinion is.

I would stay and enjoy a visit at the bandstand anyone here worked, whatever the material or equipment.

But, when I see a laptop on a bandstand and don't know the performer, I leave, PERIOD! DJ's and Karaoke? FORGET IT!

I don't look down on those who use whatever they use,

I guess it's all in the eye of both the performer and members of the audience.

UD and Donny are two of my favorites, but they will never convince me that it's OK for ME to use laptops, sequences, MP3's or much of the automation that's available. I only use an arranger when there is no alternative, and that, believe it or not, is rarely...not 10 % of my jobs. That does not mean I think that they shouldn't do whatever they like; it DOES mean that they should respect my choice to do it differently. (and, it goes without saying, I'm sure that's the case).

Some are entertainers; I'm not. For some, the show is the deal. For me, content is everything. My audiences are smaller and much more critical. Incidentally, Tony, sometimes, I have to play "behind a ham sandwich"...so quietly, I don't interrupt the discussions going on st the table. I'm often the "invisible" musician LOL!

In a major way, I've sold out. I play society music for big bucks, when, as a "purist", I should be playing hardline jazz in a run-down warehouse for next to nothing. I'm just not that much into STARVATION! LOL!

There is no RIGHT WAY...just the way that each of us can live with.

Here's hoping each of us has continued success; however we define it.


Respectfully,


Russ (think I'll start using a kazoo) Lay

I agree Russ..."if you have to tell everyone how good you are....you're probably NOT!"

In my case, I don't have any exceptions.

The best players I know, are also quite humble, and have no need to stroke their own ego, or have any one else do it for them.

Case in point with me, was Oscar Peterson...I spent most of the day with the man, showing him how to get the most from a PSR-9000Pro, and he was one of the gentlest, and most humble people I have ever met...it felt like I always knew him.

In my job, I meet some very, very talented performers, and those with big egos are, fortunately, in the minority.

I'm much the same regarding seeing a single performer using laptop, Russ, and if they aren't actually playing during the performance, I leave.

I'm not a fan of Karaoke at anytime.

Ian

No use asking anyone UD if you did sound better then, they are probably all dead

You guys do know..there are many functions a laptop will do for you...To judge an act because you see a laptop on stage,,is just foolish...and this coming from my synthzone friends...

A laptop is used for lyrics, that some of us can't remember...or it could be the chords of a tune...maybe more than just the 4 basic chords some of you use

It could be the backing parts that are needed to present the song in a way the audience wants to hear...

It could be the source of sounds the performer is using, VST's and superior sounds than you would get from a PAx or Tyros..
It could be the soft arranger program instead of a bulkier arranger keyboard...

The laptop could be the instrument that runs the show...lighting, sound, programing etc..

It could be the tool for break music....

It could be the best resource for request songs..


BTW: the arranger keyboards we use, the workstation keyboards we use, the digital piano we use, are all in the fashion of a laptop (without the keys)...These keyboards are computer based..the components are inside as in the laptop..

Think about it before you judge by what you think you see..

Tony, I was there and yes he did sound better....Today he has lost his way..using Korg arranger keyboards, Bose "hat rack" systems

25 years ago , he was smarter...he used Rhodes Moog, and Roland drum machines and synths....He just lost his way

Sorry - but the whole karaoke analogy is in my opinion, tosh.

If a singer has a 5 piece band behind them, does it make them any better or worse than a singer with a Recording of a 5 piece band behind them?

Have you thought that maybe the vocalist singing to a backing track is:
a: getting paid as much as if they had a keyboard player/band with him/her. (how many of you dropped your bands in the 70s and brought an organ with rhythms because you could get more money as a solo artist?)

b: can't get a keyboard player/band up to the standard of the backing track. (maybe the vocalists are having the same trouble you as a keyboard player are)

c: just enjoy working on their own. Just as some of you guys do.

I know a few amazing vocalists that sometimes sing with a band or guitarist and sometimes use their own, or commercial backing tracks (Big band/ Swing).

Also....I know a few bands who reinforce their sound with backing tracks, pre-prepared by themselves. For instance the female vocalist of a local Showband sings over her own voice which is her backing singer. It also has the click track which runs through their in ear monitors. They are already a five piece and play small venues. (If they employed more vocalists, a third guitarist and second keyboard player it wouldn't even cover their fuel costs)

At the end of the day, the audience is there to be entertained and so use every means available to make sure the crowd get there moneys worth.

The only exception are 'professional audiences' (e.g. jazz clubs)who pay to experience the unique interaction and inspiration that happens between good musicians playing together.

As long as nobody is faking/miming its all good stuff as far as I am concerned.

Fran,

He's lost is way because he's lost his memory, he's forgot what he sounded like, have you thought you have too. I can't remember what I did today Fran

Definitely one of the silliest acts I have seen in a long while..

If I see a laptop being used to play SMF/MP3...strike one.

If the singer/performer spends little or no time actually playing the keyboard and is essentially a Karaoke act...strike two.

If the singer/performer is unprepared, unprofessional and can’t hold my attention...strike three.

We all have our limitations; the above are mine....I wouldn't waste my time or money to see a performer with any of the aforementioned issues.

There are too many genuine player/performers out there I can be enjoying...McRorie is one I would see again and again...he's the real deal, and despite the genre not being for every one's tastes, there's no denying he plays all parts "live"...drums, bass, rhythm, lead, vocals...he has earned the moniker "Power Single" in my opinion.


Ian

Fran, I ABSOLUTELY know what a laptop will be used for when I survey a bandstand. I can't remember when I was wrong.

I have the right to my opinion, which is, I don't like it, and I WALK AWAY! Almost everyone I have ever heard uses them as crutches to coverup their lack of talent.

It's pure preference, not ignorance. I can tell what I'm going to hear (in most cases) by looking at the kind of and set-up of a sound system and other stage equipment. Certainly, I can tell what someone is likely to play by looking at the kind and set-up of a guitar.

I guess everyone has their right to have an opinion about my opinion (gets complicated, don't you think?), but to call that opinion uninformed or silly is disrespectful.

That gets me a little bent out of shape, so I guess I'll just have to console myself on the private 747 to my job in Dubai in a week or two, or when I cash the $17,000.00 check that came in the mail today for a 15 minute film score for a local corporation. I can laugh all the way to the bank!

Again, it is my right to:

* learn all the lyrics so I don't need a laptop.

* Play music that is possible to do well with the
equipment and personnel on the bandstand without
"ghost tracks" which are impossible to do live.

* Choose other options than arranger play. I make more
playing solo instrumental guitar at some venues than
three piece bands make.

* Appreciate the arranger for what I use it for...an
occasional live performance instrument, but mostly, a very
good tool to do film score roughs with. I could actually
use the arranger for lots of completed scores, but, if
the budget is sufficient, I play all parts and hire top
area musicians, even when it costs me, and no one would
know the difference when mix down is complete (but ME!).

So, again, when I see a DJ, a laptop or Karaoke, I GET UP AND LEAVE! I respect others' right to doing things their way, but I DON"T HAVE TO LIKE IT OR DO THE SAME.


SO THERE!

R.

And here I am ...still sitting, waiting for the mailman to deliver my $85 check from a nursing home...so I can go to dinner at Crackerbarrel....

Oink! Oink! Let me present:

Lady Gaga (ever see her without makeup)
Nina Simone (loved her but...dammmmmmn)
Kate Smith (good thing she was patriotic)
Kelly Clarkson (check out her early 'Idol' auditions)
Carol Channing (UGH)
Janis Joplin
Grace Jones
Susan Boyle
Minnie Pearl

Any of these women could make you consider 'switching teams' . I'm not saying that good looks is not an added bonus, BUT......personally, I'd rather listen (yeah, even on stage) to an ugly girl that can really sing than a pretty girl that can't.

chas

Fran, got to go to work. I like you and hope you know that I consider this a basic difference of opinion, which in no way affects our personal relationship.

I'd be honored to be on your bandstand, laptop, MP3's girls (especially the girls) and all.


Be well,


Russ (REALLY AGREE ON THE GIRL THING) Lay

Chas on this rare occasion I agree with you 100%....
if you want a sex show go to a topless bar I say....
what the music sounds like to the listener enjoying it is where the beauty lies IMO.

As normal with internet forums, ignore the relevant comments and pick up on the details to reinforce a matter of opinion into fact.

Thankfully in the real world these 'discussions' don't hold any water.

By the way, Gaga's usual No Make up face is actually part of her display and is just more careful makeup. This photo is from before Gaga and the real person.

Who are we to judge? .....look in the mirror people sheeeesh.
As far as lady gaga she make 90 million last year?, now that's a beautiful thing..

Come on Chas, that isn't fair...we were talking about us common folks hiring girl singers...

That list of Corporate marketing, over hyped, over produced "ladies".....


You do have some homely gals on that list........but there are only a couple on that list that could drop in at the CrabTrap and fill in on stage...they are not bread and butter performers..and I dare to say could not cut it..

and not just the ones that are dead

Oh Oh! Looks like I riled up a Gaga fan. Yeah, I'm sure she wakes up every morning with eyebrows trimmed, lashes plucked and combed, lips glossed, and every hair in place. My bad. I've seen this woman???? a number of times on TV WITH makeup and I stick by my decision to include her on my 'ugly' list. On balance, as I "look in the micro" , I'm pretty sure I'd be on hers too.

chas

Glad you were able to get back in time to edit that post. Maybe you could try "Preview" and save some time (and I can stop trying to figure out how to "look in the micro".

BTW, what does Gaga making 90M have to do with her being on my list? You can't equate everything to money (although you seem to keep trying to). In fact, it just proves my point, that you CAN be 'less than pretty' and still be sucessfull. Here's a test for you; would you like me any better if I made 90 million? I didn't think so.

Fran, you know I was just pulling your chain. EVERY guy in our age group is a male chauvinist pig .

chas

I am not a Gaga fan at all, although some of her stuff is good, just wouldn't catch me at a concert. Kylie is more up my street. Now there is a nice lass, she writes good songs, sings live (sometimes to backing tracks), keeps her nose clean and has AMAZING legs

Speaking of GaGa, the Lady ... have any of you seen this ? ...



I have looked at a number of the Duet vids from this CD ... regardless of what the OTHER performer is wearing, Tony ALWAYS is the picture of CLASS ...

After a few drinks...the listener could care less what the music sounds like......but that sexy looking girl keeps getting better with each drink...even the ugly ones..

I have to tell you.....you guys really saved my life this time around! You reminded me of all the bad experiences I ever had attempting to work with a female vocalist.

Bill Lewis: “The gigs too far, my boyfriend/fiance/ex/husband, I'm tired from work, my voice isn't right tonight, etc. etc.”

Russ: “Boyfriend problems...money problems...."no shows"...being unhappy with the sound system, material, number of songs she sang or stage....the list goes on and on.”

Don M: “I've worked with several and they were mostly a pain in the butt. Had a couple who were really good, but there is always some sort of baggage.”

I forgot I went through most of the above myself. I really need to eat more brain food so I remember these horrific scenarios!

The common denominator with many of them was “they didn’t want to practice or learn songs...just sing what they knew and start making money!” Then there were the ones, like Fran said, who were anxious to get on the gravy train, but I would have had to spend the rest of my life training them about the business. Then they'd probably open up their own pizza joint and quit the business anyway!

The good singers were prima donna’s and the “not-so-good” were only useful as live poster boards to be sprayed with exotic perfume to stand on the stage looking like Geisha girls.

But Eddie came up with a great idea: “I found my last one by going to Karaoke venues and keeping and eye and ear out for one who would like to join me and who would bring added value to what I was doing.”

I think I might go that route for a while and see what I come up with.

My second choice, to get a female voice in the act, was to buy a sampler, have a lady friend I know with a legit voice, sing 2-3 second snippets of different parts of a song, record them into a sampler, and sing duets with myself. But that would involve split-second timing. I’d have to hit that sampler button exactly when I want her to “come in”....to the millisecond! Easier to keep any given thread in the SynthZone on topic!

There was a song a few years back, I can’t remember the title. But it had this message in it:

I’d like to fall in love, but I can’t afford the price. I’m sure you get my analogy!

Mark

Mark, I actually do sing duets with myself, as a gag. There is a preset on the vocal processor on the PA3X that instantly transforms my voice up an octave, and it sounds just like a girl. I can switch from my real voice to the girl and back with one push of a button, or assign it to a foot switch.
Sometimes I "introduce" my female singer guest artist for the night, and then sing "Crazy" (because that's the song EVERY girl that ever sat in with anybody wants to sing). It IS really funny. You'd have to be there. Or not.
I also use that setting when working with my friend Dean Mathis because we have to do his famous hit "I Like Bread and Butter".
DonM

Tony.......what's a contract?

Don,

I know you said you do "Crazy" as a “joke," but I’m wondering if the “female voice” done through the Helicon comes anywhere near close to a “passable” female voice. If so, that would save me the “discomfort” of trying to find a live vocalist.

What do you think? With the money I save, I can contribute to the Arranger Player's Retirement Fund.

Mark

No need to save for that. Most get shot on stage trying to play a jazz venue. Send that extra cash to the Starving Jazz Musicians Fund instead.



chas

LOL! As DonM says, that sort of thing is good for a laugh for a one-off number, but Mark, do yourself, and your audiences, a favour; please don't use that feature on a regular basis, it'll get real old real quick. I think that if I had to resort to that, I save the money and buy a gun myself.

Why try to be something you're not? Willie Nelson Wrote "Crazy" - sing it as he would!
Other typically associated "chick tunes" that were written and/or recorded by by male artists include:
"I will Survive", "Me and Bobbie McGee", "Wind Beneath My Wings", "I Can't Make You Love Me" (too many to remember right now) .... just be yourself.
(although, i DO have a fun time using the Barry White sound on my TC harmonizer .... it's too hard to resist!)

I don't believe you could fool anyone into thinking a real live girl was singing. But maybe if you tweaked enough settings . . .who know.
DonM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2xzWbRwOio


Here is a girl that could use Don's harmonizer...and Mark should contact her...it will make his duo a hit...

I couldn't get half way through that 'thing' ... I will NEVER understand why people post stuff like that on you tube or ANYWHERE ... are they so in need of attention - even if it is BAD?!?!? ...
Somewhere this girl has family and/or friends ... aren't they embarrassed for her??? ... couldn't SOMEONE convince her to take this off the 'net ???

C'mon Fran.......she's obviously one of the patients that was in that insane asylum that Jack Nicholson was riding herd on in that "Shining" movie!

I’m still reeling from the cocktail party/social event I did at a friend’s house Friday night. It was advertised as “piano entertainment” but open to anyone who plays an instrument.

No sooner did I take my first break then Bill asks if he could play, as he “needs to entertain when he’s around people.” He had a “night club” spiel, but his playing and singing was completely off key. I couldn’t take more than 10 minutes of him. When I said to him, I’m going back on in 5 minutes, he replied (as he slammed down the cover) “you can play right now!” He also stormed out the front door.

Next was Susan, self-taught pianist. She taught herself how to play, but forgot to teach herself how to play to an audience! She played great songs, but...boom, boom, boom one song after another. No intro’s, endings, breaks, dynamics...nothing to indicate she was changing songs. Heck she even played Beer Barrel Polka in the same way she played Love is a Many-Splendored thing. After 30 songs, even I couldn’t tell where one ended and the other began. I politely told her I was returning to the piano. She obliged me. That was an easy one!

Then Artie the guitarist. Nice fellow, polite, respectful, but was too frightened to play his 70’s repertoire without me playing behind him. At least he left the stage without me having to call a bouncer.

Now, Jimmy the Fiddler. Wrote his own Karaoke backing tracks and proceeded to play the fiddle to each track. After 15 minutes of that, I yelled over to him that it was “time to go.” He made like he didn’t hear me. I had to pour ice water over his head!

Patricia, the children’s and nursing home entertainer. Does When You’re Smiling and Hello Dolly. I had difficulty backing her up, because I had to use my hands to cover my ears. She sounded like a man who sounded like a woman! I’m like in Bb and she’s somewhere in R#. Two songs was all she was going to get from me!

Richard, big husky Richard with the big, baritone voice and a bag full of CD’s to sell. I figured I couldn’t go wrong with him...professional...I thought. He sang Some Enchanted Evening and The Way You Look Tonight...badly. Swallowed his words and choked on some of them. His excuse: Couldn’t sing with an “accompanist he didn’t know and hadn’t worked with previously.” At least he got off the stage under his own volition.

The last act...Lucky and Florence. He’s an old time vaudeville pianist/singer from Brazil, probably about 110 years old and “sings in 27 languages“ (unfortunately English not being one of them). She’s an ex-dancer from England, maybe a year younger than him. So while she did Zumba movements, he hammered away at that piano for 45 minutes. By then I was too tired to even chase him off the stage. I gave up the fight!

Here’s my point: I was relaying all that to a music friend the next morning and asked her “WHY…..on Earth, do I need a “hook” to get these people off stage?” (the fiddle player I had to hit over the head with a broomstick after I drowned him in ice water). The answer: “this is a day and age when people are plain self-centered and full of themselves. They care about no one around them, and are going to do what pleases them, no matter who else has to suffer through it. In short, welcome to the “ME” generation!

My friend is more in touch then I am! Heck, I still think Teddy Roosevelt is President.

Anyhow, I wrote all this out, because it’s easier to do this than to go to therapy. I’m still recovering from it all! I swear....that’s the first and last time I allow my benevolence to supersede my own playing! I'll drink a gallon of bleach before I let that happen again!

Mark

This was done in late 90's. this woman used to sing with the Demensions, and now sings with us...

forget it- can't upload mp4's

Mark, here's my simple advice on how to hire the best singers and musicians in town: Get a gig first then hire the best talent you can. If you're paying at least the "going rate" in your area and the singer/musician is availble the date you need them they will probably take your offer. Now if you appraoch a professional or even a semi pro/hobbiest with " I'm trying to get a dou started- are you available to rehearse?" your not going to have much luck. Who has time for that?!?

So get a gig, call up Ms. Pro Singer, if she accepts have her email you a list of her tunes (with the keys she sing them in) Then you have to do your homework and work up her tunes and just show up to the gig and play.

Good luck!

I've come to the conclusion it was easier to find the Titanic than it is to find a sane female vocalist. Besides, my Horoscope said I only have 11 days left to live!

Mark

Perhaps, if all you confirmed 'power solos' (snort, chortle!) have had trouble with girl singer after girl singer disappointing you, perhaps the fault lies with who YOU tend to get to want to sing with YOU...

The world is chock a block with great singers... but maybe they are looking for a GREAT player to back them up?

Not a machine.

Let's see, I wouldn't marry a woman with big boobs.....and nothing else.

and

I wouldn't work with a female vocalist with a great voice.......and nothing else!



I would guess that's probably why I can't find one! I fail miserably in that department!

I think Dolly Parton is spoken for already.
DonM

Ahhhhh...Dolly Parton...a lovely couple!

I'll take BEFORE !!!

I was at the produce counter the other day and said to the girl stacking 'em up, "I like a nice pear." She punched me in the nose.:D

WHAT? That picture is loaded with makeup!!!! Geeze ... I have 4 daughters (one is an in-law), and I can recogize a made up face with ease. Lashes, lipstick .... she's all painted up.

DonM,

For me, you'd need to get down to a size 38,24,38, and like 115 to 135 lbs, wear lipstick, a wig and be beautiful. Wow that would call for a female!!

Chas

If you made 90mil a minute, no one would like you any better. Same goes for me. You (we) are too damn obnoxious son!!

Tell the truth! If you weren't a bricklayer, you must have been or are a Hod Carrier right?

You ain't fooling no body you old fart.

Fran why in the world are you doing music for peanuts? You are the only one here on the forum that has the potential to make big, big money.

You're in the wrong place at the wrong time. However, you could be in the right place at the right time in less than a couple of days. Run for something, be a politician !!

One bit of extremely good advice though is to change the being up front honest approach. Continue to use the in your face up front approach. but be conniving and tell half truths some times, but most of the time you have to be very dishonest. In other words lie lie lie.

The voters will love you to take advantage of them. Read lots of newspapers you'll be richer than Rush one day. Ha ha!
Sorry Fran, "The Devil Made Me Do It." Hey Don this could be a country song too.

Don't remember carrying any Hods but then again, I wasn't always completely sober in my youth so I may have carried a Hod or two. As far as being an 'ol' fart', you're right on the money with that one, a characteristic I share with two of my heroes, Fran and Russ, along with our mutual STRONG admiration for 'the ladies'. Sadly, only Fran seems to be able to get any, BUT, like a dog chasing a car, what do you do when you catch it?



chas

[quote
Don't remember carrying any Hods but then again, I wasn't always completely sober in my youth so I may have carried a Hod or two. As far as being an 'ol' fart', you're right on the money with that one, a characteristic I share with two of my heroes, Fran and Russ, along with our mutual STRONG admiration for 'the ladies'. Sadly, only Fran seems to be able to get any, BUT, like a dog chasing a car, what do you do when you catch it?
chas


Chas,
I know what ya mean friend. I'm down to three times a night thinking about it. What's funny is it's OK. It's not a big deal anymore, and really who doesn't enjoy a pretty face eh?

But still to me it is extremely annoying if they are tone deaf and sing out of tune. I can't stand it.

It's like McLean Stevens said on a show one night when this broad walks into the room with a 2 foot high hair do. He says to a friend next to him, "man with harr like that she could be "QUEEN OF COUNTRY."

He had an outfit on that looked like it was made of pure silver with sequins on it and a ten gallon hat way bigger than a Mexican sombrero! I'd love to see that show one more time before I go.

Sheeesh.... I hope no one is drinking while they are performing on stage.....and driving afterwards?

????????????

Donny,

Catching me drinking and driving is impossible. Even when young playing five 6AM jam sessions a week, I didn't drink. I'm a teetotaler.

Many of our family friends told me, man you're just like your Dad. Well the story is that my Dad was the nicest guy you'd ever meet.

However, when drinking he thought that he was Clark Gable and that all of the ladies were madly in love with him. Then, if the husbands objected, he immediately turned into "MIKE TYSON." NO Crap!!! I saw it with my own eyes.

So if I was just like him according to many comments, I figured I'd not drink at all and learn to apologize like "Big Tiny" DonM.

That's what I don't like about bands. Many members drink way too much and if they're not doing that they are smoking too much marijuana or snorting something else.

They ought to take "Ativan." It is more affordable, less habit forming, works great, it's legal and helps millions cope. However, it doesn't make you play your ax better like marijuana, coke, herion, opium and all the other [potty mouth] they take. What a world eh?

OMG Bill- I think yours works for me now!

As for drinking on the gig- that time is long over. I'll have one in the beginning to loosen up, and then it's pepsi/coke to keep me going. And I always have water on stage. Sometimes I'll have one if a customer buys to keep good "audience" relations, but I've even politely said no to that at times. I need to say awake for some of those 2+ hour rides home.

At this age, I'm basically banned from drinking with the medications I take. I'm no kid- the stuff just puts me to sleep!

Sonya did this some time ago but sings with me now..don't know who put it together but video seems out of sync with vocal but you get the idea...can anybody open this?

Sparky,

Couldn't open the Zip file, but I can relate to out of synch video to audio. Much of this has to do with the conversion, and it took me some time to figure it out. The various video formats have differing synch problems, but with a bit of work you can synch them using Windows Live Movie Maker.

Cheers,

Gary

Boo drinking is the least of it with many,... hey, I'm out here in NJ gigging almost every day or night and Water is my BEST friend on stage...especially as a vocalist/player.