I would like to use a program like Cakewalk Sonar to make my own composer styles for my technics PR305 electric piano. I want to be able to make the drum beat, fill 1, fill 2 and variation etc....is it possible to do this in SONAR???

Mushka

not directly to piano format.

if your piano has sequencer to composer copy feature in the sequencer menu, yes.

if your piano can record composers from midi information, yes.

but this is basically something that requires a bit of experience using cakewalk, (maybe midi) and the piano. There are no shortcuts or specific functions to help you out, so it has to be done manually so to speak. And you may have to create a cakewalk instrument definition for your piano first.

How about we make the software ourselves then! Something that can take midi information and put it into a .cmp format.

I can help with the Visual Basic code. I have been fiddling around with a hex editor and saving a .cmp file from the keyboard, then viewing it in a hex editor to find out what changes what.

Let me know what you think.

If they don't have it....let's make it ourselves.

if only it was that easy...
Visual Basic is the easy part, de-compiling the composer format is the hard part... too many variables.

In years gone by I used to change all the hex identifier codes of the organ and piano disks so they would work on the keyboards, also enabling the loading of all the keyboard presets that would not load from one series into another, thus getting every preset style from every KN ever made, but never tried programming composers by trial and error.

You need to talk to Thomas at http://www.thkmcs.de/ because he managed an editor for 3000 format.

Also EMC software at http://www.emc-software.de/taste/ has software to convert midi to composer direct, but not in a direct format for your piano.

However no-one has cracked the 6000 compression yet, and we now have 7000 format to look forward to...

the 6000 series has a sequencer to composer copy function that enables you to make composers out of suitably prepared midis.

if you manage something for your piano I send you best wishes and wish you the very best of luck.

I have made a start on my PR305, mapping the instruments to their particular Hex values. This doesn't seem to be a problem so far as I have changed a composer file via hex and swapped instruments around without a problem.

How did I do this?

I started off at the keyboard composing a 1 bar rhythm just using the 4 x quarter notes with the bass drum. I composed another 1 bar rhythm with 4 x quarter notes using the high-hat. I then loaded both these files into Hex Workshop 3.1 and compared them. This highlighted the differences within 3 seconds and I was able to easily find where the instrument information was stored.

I am in the process of doing the rest of the rhythm instruments. After this, I will vary two files and compare them by having one file with eight notes and the other file with quarter notes...both using the same instrument....I think you can see where this is going.

Let's do this...it *can* be done....and if there is anyone else out there with the same drive I have...feel free to join me.

Email me if you would like to help out or simply come along for the ride. I am looking for people with all sorts of experience be it just with a technics keyboard or VB/C++ programming experience.

This is a project I am undertaking but I want it to be dynamic...I want any of you guys to be able to use this program to make composer files for your particular keyboard......with ease.

I know it isn't an easy task, but the more heads that are on this...the better.

Brad.

Hi Brad,
good luck with the project.

Here's the problem.
Your pr305 is maybe 8 years old. That puts it around the same era as the kn2000.

Each generation of ensemble, piano and keyboard will have different formats as the features change.

Normally the digital ensembles, pianos and keyboards will not load each others formats generally speaking, but it is possible if you change the hex identifier codes in order to get all the different presets from different instruments to be usable in your instrument, which I have done for years. It is simpler if you ignore sounds and panel memories, but for style from midi we only need composer anyway, so this is good.

If you manage to produce a program for your 305 format, it may be pretty easy to just identify it as a 2000 format, which enables me to load it into my kn6500.

However there could be problems with other ensembles, keyboards and pianos of differing generations, such that the format you create in is not loadable in many other machines. We could use EMC works software to do this, but this was developed for keyboards, so results in trying to re-identify for pianos and ensembles may be hit and miss.

So the first problem is converting to a composer format that is usable to a wide range of technics users in terms of tracks and measure lengths, because the maximum available will vary with different models.

The second problem is that 6500/903 composer format is now 8 track rather than 5. The new formats are also compressed with an algorithm that has not been cracked yet. So the last uncompressed format available with direct hex editing access is kn5000 format, which was still 5 track.

However if you can map drums, bass, and 3 accompaniment, that should be enough to get a good result out of a midi. We have been doing it for years with the EMC software, which has a midi to composer module which works quite well. A cut down version of the same module is available on floppy for direct use in the 5000 and 6000 generations of keyboards.

Also the keyboards now have sequencer to composer copy functions. If you edit the measures you are interested in to C major (or a constant chord) in Sonar, you get your composer quite easily. Even easier to get all the styles from Band in a Box and other arranger type programs.

If you send me a measure of midi data in C major, I can send you the composer in kn2000 format, you then see if it loads into your piano with a model identifier hex change.

If you then create a series of 1 measure midis in C major, we may be able to get them converted and you can map the byte changes for every drum, note and note length? This should save some work for you at least. But there are many more variables to get a result that will be worthwhile musically?