There are possibilities of using VST in Linux (http://djcj.org/LAU/ladspavst/). This can mean that Mediastation will be first autoarranger that can use VST instruments as a standard feature.

And they already have Mediastation Lite -- for only 2990 euro (without mixer and only with one of two DSPs).

I want this beast -- not even Lite, I want Standard or even Pro! It can be more fun than we all can imagine.

[This message has been edited by ailev (edited 02-03-2004).]

The problem here is how many VSTs are actually available that run in Linux?

The Pro, there are more VST will run at Linux-autoarranger than zero at any of today's arrangers (exept complex sofware arrangers not designed for real-time performance).

I want any autoarranger with at least several VST -- not all of them

Hi Aliev
I saw that you had looking at my website and saw what Mediastation can do...
Well, I don't want to tell anymore what mediastatin can do, why at the NAMM we had saw what the other company can offer..

i'm sorry that a lot of people here don't saw in real Mediastation working but slow slow, I see that someone here, step by step understant the possibility that Linux give, without spend a lot money for the software.

I saw and a little tested the Neko too, really a nice keyb and nice guys, I know now the Victor too, really a smart guy.
neko is really a nice product, all the performance that Windows XP offer, sure much more application than mediastation, but you must always use the pointer with the keypad or touchscreen, one operation at time and in almost the application is not possible use the all knobs and key's.
Again, nice PC but is NOT a keyboard.

Anyway, if you like windows, you can run under Linux too ( http://www.winehq.com/ ) and have more windows application that you like, BUT NOT linked in the key's, led's, Sliders, why is NOT possible! Maybe if someone get the source code of the application, some is possible to do.

I'm friend with all the guys there and I want that all there be my friends too.
We just have a different products, ideas and marketing.
Just look what George Kaye say in this forum and you have again the confirm what the others can do.
In conclusion I don't have nothing to add and nothing to learn.
IF someone had made or can made some better like my Mediastation, then let me know and we can share togheter the best technology hardware/software keyboard in the world.

Maybe I'm wrong and blind but really i can't see who can do better like Mediastation.
All you guys there are so smart, please help me find who really can compete with Mediastation, I really missing know.

cheers
Domenik

aliev is right, some is better than nothing.
The fact is the following, there are already two companies providing VST 2.3 VST playback in dedicated expanders wich run a PC with Linux inside. Why Linux and not Windows ? As usual because the better stability, performance and tweakability.
Except some plugins that come with a complicated copy protection for example plugzilla ( http://www.plugzilla.com ) claims to run pratically any VST plug on their hardware.
I met the plugzilla guys at NAMM and saw it in action works really great.

So the possibilities for the Mediastation regarding VST are either use the open source VST server or license the technology from folks like Plugzilla.
The free VST server development will advance at rapid pace too so expect the list of supported VST plugs grow quickly.

aliev, just for curiousity what kind of VST plugs (or mention thm by name, eg NI B4 etc) would be important to you for running them on the Mediastation ?

cheers,
Benno

http://www.linuxsampler.org




[This message has been edited by sbenno (edited 02-05-2004).]

sbenno,
thank you for a good question. Sure, I will not be speaking about "bread and butter" VSTi like replics of Great Old Evergreen Instruments. I will not be showing to you VST reviews like http://www.kvr-vst.com does. "Marketing advice" is very simple: take first 10 most popular plugins (popular according to any statistics).

I'll better point you to the trend: it is morphing that rules in today's music industry. Morphing is most technically difficult and musically fresh concept that earn more and more attention in our postmodern world.

For me personally it will be interesting to try at Mediastation:

White Noise Additive Sinth (http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/2004/White-Noise-Additive-Synth.html)

Cameleon 5000 Additive Morphing Resynthesiser (http://www.camelaudio.com/productsCA5000.htm)

Symptohm:Melohman (http://www.ohmforce.com/ViewProduct.do?p=Symptohm)

I tell you that you should pay attention for performance-oriented (not sequvencer-oriented for home computer work) VSTis. Mediastation performance-oriented too with all it's sliders and buttons.

And then we can speak about morphing of styles -- but it is shure not a VST story.

about plugin players

I think there are should be Mediastation with 2 or 4 slots for expansion boards with CPU and memory only. This slots can be dedicated VST plugins player. Hardvare without plugins will be obsolete nowdays.

Strength of Mediastation solution can be... price! E.g. price of Plugzilla consist of price (possible 2) CPU and memory -- this is unavoidable in Mediastation case -- plus box, knobs, hard drive, fans, electric power system, ADC\DAC, inputs and outputs. Mediastation have it all! I.e. "plugzilloid" can be worth not more than $700 per 4 channel luxury VST play -- instead $3200 at plugzilla stadalone.

Think about it: such a board can host plugzilla's technology or opensource plugin server or whatelse (e.g. not VST-compatible extension).

Anyway you can already market your Mediastation and plugzilla as complete solution (up to cross sale technics).

That is my Grand Performance Setup-2004 can be:
Mediastation $6200
Additional keyboard controller $700
Plugzilla $3200
Bose L1+2*B2 left $2300
Bose L1+2*B2 right $2300

$14700 with free VST only -- too much for restorant players, but affordable for many others (e.g. for me ).

Thanks for the valuable input and feedback aliev !
I have even a better idea of extending the Mediastation's CPU's power (to run VST and other kind of CPU intensive software).
Take a rackmount device with a standard PC in it (can be AMD Athlon, P4 or Opteron for screaming 64bit performance). No midi cards, non audio cards, only ethernet, and a hard drive thus it's very cheap.
Connect it to the Mediastation through the ethernet cable (can be either 100Mbit o 1Gbit).
This allows for real time streaming of audio/midi data between the Mediastation and with only a couple of msec of added latency thus undetectable in live performance.
Under Windows something similar exists, FX Teleport, made in Russia :-)

The price/performance ratio of this "VST/FX slave" would exceptional. For as low as $1000 you can probably get a dual athlon box with tons of CPU power.
We will keep all protocols and programming APIs open this means you can build your own CPU expander too if you wish.
Or if one box is not enough have a cluster of slave machines providing unlimited CPU power.
We are working on the same networking concept
in LinuxSampler (cluster of LinuxSampler boxes controlled by a VSTi/AudioUnit that runs under Windows/Mac), the same concept can be used to run VSTi plugs under VST server on Linux.
Let us first finish the Mediastation then we will work on extending its capabilities with the CPU expander like mentioned above.

As said open protocols, APIs and software will be very valuable to users on musical instruments too, but until yet noone has made this step. We will put an end to this situation

cheers,
Benno

http://www.linuxsampler.org



[This message has been edited by sbenno (edited 02-06-2004).]

sbenno,
plugzilla is $3200 box "turnkey", but CPU expander from PC tower+ethernet is $1000 plus system administrator work (OS installing than tuning, plugin host instolling, network routing etc. + the same tuning work from Mediastation part).

Musicians are about music, not system administration. Personally I'll prefer simply take Mediastation plus expansion kit (box, card, etc.) that I will not be tuning and tweaking from the beginning.

I think it can be bootable hard drive that I can install to my computer, connect computer to Mediastation via ethernet and boot from this hard drive. But after that it should work immediately -- and it should not be tweaking of any configuration files!

It should be SOLUTION but not SERVER with API. It should be zero time setup of VST-powered Mediastation. Better of all it should be Mediastation with hardware VST-option, not external CPU expander...

This is why Windows win from Unix 10 years ago. Windows was capable of doing 3 things immediately from boot. Unix was capable of doing 300 things after configuration and tweaking and tuning.

Mediastation and CPU expander should be like devices, not like software systems.

I am afraid that from possibility of VST playing from Mediastation to robust VST turn-key Mediastation solution will be couple of years...