o3bor: if you read my post more carefully, you will see that I actually wrote that I was unable to find demo's of styles making use of the sampled loops. I hope to find them in the future, since this is a feature that really interests me.
Regards,
A.

Yes Diki, that is correct - but only for use as a midifile play machine - not as a true style based arranger. I would never have considered buying it in the first place for that purpose.



That is a fair point, but in this instance it is not lack of familiarity which is the issue. I think the operating system on the G70 is very user friendly, whereas the old Korg's was fairly horrible. However, I felt that Korg had done an excellent job on the front panel ergonomics on the i3, whereas the G70 (and many other makes/models, to be fair, including other Korg models) are less good in this important respect.

There is no such thing as a perfect instrument, and I don't mind having to find the odd work-around to get some things done. However, the basic hardware design and panel layout of an instrument is something you have to live with every time you play the instrument, so it needs to be "right" from the start.

Quote:

Quote "The lack of proper "break" buttons makes it a none starter in terms of the most basic style control functions" just means that Mike is probably unaware that OS2 re-introduced the Break/Mute function, and tied it to the AssignSW by the left hand.

Sorry - my comment was misleading. Wrong terminology! I actually meant "Fill" buttons rather than "Break" buttons. I am aware that OS2 functions as you describe, and this is good.

What I wanted was a set of dedicated buttons to enable instant free access to any "Fill" pattern within the style. Ideally, these would have the ability to be set within each user programme so that the user can decide which main variation the "fill" leads into, rather than being stuck with the factory choices only.

Quote:

...The fill buttons are in a cluster of four in the Style Control section. They double as Variation selection, all you have to have is the Auto Fill-in button enabled and as you select whether you change variations or return to the same, a fill is triggered.

Yes - this is what I am complaining about. Although this functionality is OK in it's own right, it is just not versatile enough. It would have been nice for this feature to have been offered this as an additional convenience function, but it is not an adequate substitute for a proper set of dedicated fill buttons.

Even the minimalist panel design of the VA series managed to find room for ONE fill button..... :-)

Quote:

You can also trigger the variation and fills from Rolands excellent FC7 seven button pedalboard, making for a pretty good hands-free operation

True - but this still doesn't get round the fact that you can't introduce a partial fill towards the end of a bar (not the same as the "Half-Bar" function that is present), and you cannot divorce a particular fill from it's parent style variation (other than by programming a new style by cloning).

To me, these are essential features that I would take for granted as being present on any but the most primitive of arranger keyboards. As soon as I saw pictures of the G70 panel layout, it was obvious that the lack of dedicated fill buttons would be a potential problem to some degree.

Quote:

But if anyone from Roland is trolling, here, if you don't want the G70 to wither on the vine, get some of the hippest programmers you can find, and bring out 50-100 new styles that, at least, compare favorably with Tyros2 and other 21st century arrangers.

Amen to that sentiment!

Regards - Mike

[This message has been edited by MikeTV (edited 10-22-2005).]

[This message has been edited by MikeTV (edited 10-22-2005).]

Hey Mike

Thanks for clarifying your original post. This was a little easier to accept and understand your personal thoughts. As we all know every board has and has not. But the sound of the board must be up to snuff especially if you plan to use it in a recording environment. I only wish their were a place to see and hear all of these boards, it sure would be easier than reading and writing posts for several months, and then only to find ( After purchasing ) that you are not pleased.
In short, I think that Roland is as good as the rest but they lack BIG TIME in advertisement, support and communication with their supporters.
(U.S. that is) and us.( we). I hope that was clear.
I don't think they follow the forums as closely as their competitors. JMO....

Roland is not lacking in advertisement, what it is lacking is communicating with its users (as if in the difference between talking to someone and having a dialogue).

The spend thousands of $ publishing their newsletter - it has snazzy graphics, and nice glossy print. However, the content is absolutely useless. I, for one, don't give a #$^@ about how Christina Aguelera's band uses Roland keyboards, and to me this is a money wasted. And still, while pushing their shamelessly self-promotional crap at us, they have for years not had a way for the users to contact them and indicate what works for them and what does not.

I have been voicing my gripes about Roland keyboards here for years, and found that I am not alone with my concerns. I have also tried to write to various Roland addresses for years, but generally received no acknowledgements. Then, when Roland would come out with a new keyboard, the design would suggest that our concerns were all but ignored.

For example, while we had been asking for an OS which does not require using a touch screen when playing, the G70 relies on the touch screen even more than the VA76 did. We were asking for more buttons, but got less, asking for a lighter instrument than the G1000, only to get a back-breaking behemoth. Chiropractors must love Roland and Korg.

They did add a harmonizer, and got rid of a Zip drive, but that was more to a response to the competition than in response to our requests.

I am not saying that the G70 is bad, only that it could have been way better had Roland done what we were asking it to do. Indeed, we have to use workarounds to get by the shortcomings of various instruments, but Roland could have had a lot fewer shortcomings to work around, such as not having enough buttons for necessary functions.

The fact that Roland decided not to sell the G70 in the regular music stores further underscores the disconnect between the company and their user base, at least here in the US.

Regards,
Alex

Thats not true.The VA76 relies on the touch screen but the G-70 dont. It have lot of buttons compared to the VA-76.

Niels

Sorry, I understood that you listened the loops 'as they are' but not used in a style.
Thanks.

Hello to all,

I had a chance to spend some extensive time last wk. on this K/B and in a nut shell, will confirm what has already been said by some.
I agree that we all use our boards in different ways, so our goals and expectations may differ. Like Scott, I play live. No midi files. I want to be able to sit down and play right away, no tweeking, minimal button pushing. My expectations are high quality sounds and styles.
The sounds were for the most part, FLAT. On OS 2, still too much reverberation on the voices. The salesman and I couldn't figure out how to adjust this. Compared to the PA1X, the voices did not have the clarity, the punch, the crispness. Some of the voices almost sounded muffled.
Specifically, the pianos/organs were excellent, the blown saxes were very good. Everything else needed tweeking for my style of play. I need to spend time on improving my music skills, not pushing buttons.
The styles in general left me uninspired. I kept on searching through the mix of choices in each catagory and couldn't find that inner-satisfaction feeling when playing. (I'm sure you know what I mean) I'm not saying it wasn't possible, it would take too much time to try and find it. Many of the styles were IMO over-processed, rough, busy. For example, the Bossa Novas. Several choices available, but nothing like the PA1X's guitar bossa. This style is simple and beautiful. (Those who know it, I'm sure know.) Less is more.

The 70 has alot to offer. Rich in features, like the new guitar mode (imatating a strumming guitar folk style)and others, but it has failed to CAPTIVATE me overall in what I look for and I left not begging for more.
I do alot of reading here, and felt I should at least give my honest opinion to the group on this topic.

Seems like you enjoy Latin styles I would suggest you try to audition a Ketron
SD-1 exp? Simply awesome and the editing flexability is super too.

Niels,

When I wanted to select a sound or style, I could use the button to select the group, and then I had to use the touchscreen to pick the individual sound or style out of the screenfull (or to go to a different page). How can you do this with only the buttons?

In VA there was two rows of buttons, which lighted up in different color depending on the function - first row would select the group, the second row would select the individual item, e.g. style, performance (though for the tones you had to select the variation on screen). I did not find the individual selection buttons on the G70, leading me to believe that there is no way other than the touchscreen, to make these selections.

If you can tell me how you do it WITHOUT NEEDING TO USE THE TOUCHSCREEN (and I am not talking about the OTS buttons either), I will agree that my previous statement was indeed not correct.

Regards,
Alex

Wow, it sounds like 2.0 DID NOT address the excessive reverb problem at all, as I came away with the exact same impressions you had, when auditioning the G70 with OS 1.4.

Interestingly enough, your above description (except for the reverb complaint) echoes the impression I came away with when I had auditioned the Ketron SD1 nearly 3 years ago. I only trust this has been resolved on the SD1, by now?

Because it's obvious that different people come away with ENTIRELY DIFFERENT impressions from the exact same keyboard(s), it's obvious that it all comes down to taste: Some of us just have 'better taste' than others.

Scott