i have read a lot of the early posts on the Genesys keyboard when the instrument first came out . There is very little info on the experience of those that actually own the board now a year or so later and what their views are of this instrument compared to the like s of Korg PA1 or the Tyros keyboard. the posts i have read so far dont deal with the folowing and i would like some advice as i will be purchasing an arranger board by January 2005. I currently own a yamaha psr 8000 and it has served its purpose well . I am an arranger , composer ,song writer and choir leader. Ineed an arranger to deliver my ideas to live musicians and for use in rehearsals with the choir . my questions are

1. What problems have users of this board experienced with the Sampler and can the sampler memory be expanded beyond the factory 16mb
2. Is the 64 note polyphony causing any problems with memebers that use multilayered sounds or complex sequences ?
3. How practical has the onboard CDR been in reality and
4 has anyone actually produced any work on this machine worthy of writing to CD for public consumption.

I play live and do not use a computer for production and would prefer an all in one instrument. I am about to start a project where i will be coordinating and producing the music for a play and need an instrument that i can use any time of day or night with the least amount of setup time and maximum sound quality and recording , arranging functionality. Please help

The GEM looks good on paper. I can only assume that not very many have been sold, at least in the U.S. There seem to be two possible reasons for this: that they are difficult if not impossible to find and audition, or that they aren't as wonderful as described. I have tried to find one to play since they came out, with zero success.
DonM

Hi,

I saw your other post in the GEM forum and had planned on not getting involved with this thread since I work for Generalmusic in the US. But then, I am also a musician/keyboardist/vocalist and have been performing since the 70's with groups and solo situations. I have used many types and brands of keyboards and still am very active in performing to this day. So....

I first became aware of GEM in the mid 80's when a sales rep happened into the store where I was working at the time. I was very impressed in the features, sounds and logical layout of the instruments that he showed me which at that time was the S2 and SX2 keyboard/workstations. Ever since then I have been a GEM fan. This is way before I ever thought I would someday work for this company, so what I am going to say here is based on my initial impression toward GEM products and absolutely not due to the fact that I now (as of 2001) work for GEM USA.

GEM products have always been innovative, not imitative. Over the years, other brands have copied ideas that originated in a GEM instrument. That is one thing that I really like about GEM. They seem to push technology a bit more than other companies who tend to play it safe by creating instruments that have many of the popular features of the day but offer nothing really new and exciting. I am not saying that other companies don't come up with new ideas, it just seems that it happens more with GEM.

This is obvious with the Genesys. The Genesys is similar to the other instruments you mentioned in that it is an arranger keyboard. However it is very different in that it is also a true full-fledged professional workstation, i.e. extremely in-depth sound editing, 32 track sequencing with serious editing capabilities, included internal hard drive and CD-R/RW drive, an incredibly flexible system for storing your own presets, keyboard set-ups, etc.

To answer your specific questions;


The sampler memory cannot be increased beyond the factory memory. The sampling ability is just fine. Very good quality samples can be made with the instrument. The down side is the sample editing abilities (or lack thereof). The sampler can be useful for certain things, but if you have the desire to get into sampling in a big way, you are much better to use a program like Sound Forge or another audio/editor program on your PC. I would actually say the same thing when it comes to some of the other higher-end workstations with a sampling feature. They are good for sound effects or other basic sampling, but none of them can give you the flexibility of a PC based system.

There were a couple of forum members a while back that were looking for a flexitone sound and a long wind chimes sound. I took my Genesys Pro to a local music store and sampled the instruments for these fellows and it worked great.



Polyphony is a topic that can be discussed and argued about for days on end. I mentioned that I have been involved with keyboards for quite a few years. The first “Workstations” that hit the scenes were the Korg M1 with 16 voice polyphony and the Ensoniq ESQ-1 with 8 voice polyphony. The demo sequences on these instruments were pretty amazing given the number of available voices at any one time. Why, because the players who wrote and recorded those demos understood how to get the most out of what they had to work with. Was this cheating, heck no. It simply means that they mastered the use of the instrument. I have seen guys run out of polyphony even when they have multiple sound modules with 64 voice polyphony each and 32 or more MIDI channels at their disposal. This is simply attributed to their inexperience at arranging and sequencing. Yes, the more polyphony the better. But there are other things that pertain to the final sound produced. I.e. The quality of the individual sounds; how many actual voices are used per sound; etc.

and


It is very handy to have a CD drive built into the instrument. As an example, I have a CD of MP3 files that I use for breaks while gigging. I used to carry and set-up a portable CD player, and now I can save myself the trouble by using the internal CD drive. A tiny example, but it is still a nice convenience.

Also when learning new songs from a CD, it is nice to have the CD playback and keyboard sound coming through one set of headphones without having to do any rigging up with a mixer, etc.

To clarify what you said “worthy of writing to a CD” The Genesys records stereo audio at CD quality direct to the internal hard drive. These audio files can then be burned to a CD-R. So it is not a question of whether the instrument has the ability to deliver a quality result or not, that is dependant on the abilities of the player/singer/etc. that did the recording.

The CD burner is also great for creating backups of your personal data like custom presets, memories, styles and so forth.
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I hope all this helps a bit in your decision making process. I am sure you will hear from other GEM and Genesys owners on these and other topics.

Best Regards,

Dave McMahan
Product Manager
Generalmusic USA
and Keyboardist/Vocalist for The Impact Band www.impactband.com

Disclaimer: To whom it may concern, I sincerely hope that none of the above sounds like marketing hype. It is just the way I talk naturally. I think most people can see through that kind of stuff, I know I can and hate when I feel that I am being hustled. If any of the above seems over the top, it is purely my enthusiasm and like for the instrument that is coming through.


[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 11-21-2004).]

Don, shall we go through this again. Several times you were given the opportunity to see and play a Genesys by 2 different people at our company. On one occasion, someone even offered to go out of his way to drive an instrument to you, but you said you had other things to do. Since there is not a dealer close to you at this time we have offered to sell you one direct and give you the option to return it to us if not happy with it. Nothing to lose other than shipping costs! We go out of our way to accommodate our customers, potential customers and end-users which is one of many reasons why our sales are increasing steadily.

I seriously wish I was scheduled to be in your area so I could show you the Genesys since I think you would be fairly impressed. On the other hand, it may be that you are so negative to the idea that it might actually be good, I am afraid you wouldn’t be able to realize just how neat it is. Pity.

Just for fun, take a look at the following website. This is a fellow that has used GEM keyboards for years starting with the SX-2 arranger. He now has 3 Genesys Pro’s. www.yankeejack.com.
The Miami Herald recently had a write-up on Jack. http://www.keynoter.com/articles/2004/10/23/lattitudes/lat10.txt

Another professional entertainer who is a GEM user is Arthur Hervey. Arthur is a regular at Harrah’s in Lake Tahoe. He is using a Genesys Pro and waiting to pick-up a Genesys XP for some of his out of town gigs since he can carry the XP with him on a plane. http://jackpot.sacticket.com/jackpot/entertainment/detail?id=33224

I would say that the CD drive and burner is handy on the Genesys.

When I was with out a computer and needed to get some quick demo projects done, I was able to sequence a song on the keyboard, have the person record their vocals with the music and make an audio CD of the work. The CD is also good for backing up sounds, styles and just the different set-ups I use the keyboard for.

With just the Genesys and Sound Forge, I was able to get an original piece of mine on the local radio station.


I wish that they would seriously try to get more Gem products in the more popular music stores.

So how much? Sounds like a nice board what price range are we talking about.

------------------
qqqwq@hotmail.com

I can name 50 pros playing other brands for every one you can come up with playing a GEM. This doesn't mean one is better than other.
There are five casinos within 10 miles of me and I play fairly regularly at a couple of them.

I wish you the best, but what you said about me is wrong! I love my Tyros, but I'd dump it in a minute for something better.

DonM

Hi Don,

To cut to the chase here, if anything I said was incorrect, I apologize.
I am glad to hear that you are open to other ideas in instruments and sorry that there is not a more convenient way for you to spend time with a Genesys, at least at this time.



I can name more than fifty guys driving Chevy’s or Ford’s but only a few that drive a Ferrari. But I would sure rather be one of those guys in the Ferrari.

If I am ever traveling through your area, I would welcome the opportunity to meet with you and give you a tour of the Genesys.

Sincerely,

Dave McMahan
Generalmusic USA

Hi WDMcM. thanks for your response.I still need some clarification. I have a psr8000, expanded for sampling to 64mb ram. If the Genesys has only 16mb can you tell me if there is anyway of overcoming this limitation and if the editor is comparable or better than the psr8000.This is not a crucialelemnet in the decision to purchase but an important one never the less.

You also hint that the polyphony is a limitation that a good musician who knows the instrument can over come. I need some input fromn any of the musicians here that have used the board either professionally or as a hobbyist as to the truth of this. I am not saying that this is not the truth but someone who uses the boards version as they see it carries more weight. I need an all in one board and if this unit is inadequate for professional use as an all in one unit then i need to know. Although i grew to love my yamaha it was actually misold to me as an all in one whne the sequencer simply was inadequate for my needs.

There are some here that have used the tyros and the Korg PA1X, how does the Genesys rate compared to these units ? If George Kays is reading this can you please email me on pointgaurd200@hotmail.com as others here really value your opinion and i know that you initially reviewed the genesys when it first appeared on the scene. How does it sit in your mind now compared to the tyros and pa1x ? Againireapeat i use my current keyboard for live music, choir rehearsal and to give live musicians structured guidance for how i want the feelof a song to be. I also record and perform for other artists within my church . Thanks for all the assiatance so far. I will be in a position topurchase by mid dec and need to upgrade to do this project.

so far noone on the Genesys element of this forum has replied. Do they use the forum frequently or is there another forum that you can direct me to ?sorry to be a pain!!!!